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So...why was Carl there again??

Discussion in 'Episode 616 - Last Day on Earth' started by ZombieAndTeal, Apr 5, 2016.

  1. ZombieAndTeal

    ZombieAndTeal Member

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    Apologies if this has come up anywhere else, but I think I need clarification on why Carl was not safely behind the gates of Alexandria guarding his sister and girlfriend. I know he said to Aaron that he 'owes them', meaning his walking dead family presumably (owes what, I don't know), but with his sight now limited and the fact that he's not strong like the adult men, wouldn't it be better for him to stay home? Why did rick let him come? Was it a misguided belief rick had that Carl would be safer on the road with him? Or because he wanted to show him hilltop? I can't help but think that rick wouldn't be losing his shit quite as much when the saviours surround them in the forest, if Carl wasn't there. He's scared shitless in case anything happens to Carl, so it feels like the writers placed Carl there on that road trip to add to ricks anxiety and not for another reason to do with the story. Shame really. Unless I have totally missed some vital bit of plot!
     
  2. br0k3n

    br0k3n Member

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    Carl is there for the same reason most aboard the RV were - crap leadership on Rick's part. In fact, instead of Rick proactively assigning roles to some of his most experienced fighters - THEY tell HIM what they're going to do!
     
  3. Wu11ie

    Wu11ie New Member

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    I thought I was the only one thinking that!
     
  4. HondaS2kXD

    HondaS2kXD Well-Known Member

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    Rick already wanted to take Carl to the hilltop the first time. He's becoming more accepting of Carl's coming of age. So when Carl told him he wanted to go, it's not hard to imagine Rick would allow it.

    As to why Carl would want to go, I think you misunderstood what he said. When he said, "I owe them," I think he meant the Saviors. He knows Denise saved his life. So I think aside from wanting to help defend the group like he always has, he wants vengeance for her death. Or, if he did mean the Asz's group of survivors, they also are responsible for helping to save his life, and he owes them to help in their inevitable conflict with the Saviors.

    As to Carl's being there effecting Rick, I'm not so sure. If Carl hadn't been there, Rick would've still been shitting bricks as he realized the scale of how outnumbered and outgunned he was. When Negan talked to him and (whatever Steven Ogg's charscter's name was) tried to intimidate him, it definitely rattled Rick. But not much more so than he would already be from being surrounded by well over fifty armed men.
     
  5. Lindigo

    Lindigo Well-Known Member

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    I think Carl's comment that he "owes them" was Carl saying he owed revenge to the Saviours. I think Carl wanted to go because he wanted to hurt them. I agree it was bad judgement for Rick to allow Carl to come along, though.

    Everyone piling into the RV was necessary for the story, but any pregnant woman in fear of losing her baby or her own life would want to get to help as quickly as possible. Maggie could have stretched out as well as possible in the back seat of a regular car and they would have made far better time in getting her to the help she needed (but for the roadblocks, of course). Rick's comment that she was more comfortable in the RV just would not have been at the top of Maggie's priorities in real life.

    But the story needed to have everyone on the road, so that's the way it was, with everyone, including Carl, riding along.
     
  6. maxlvtrojan

    maxlvtrojan Member

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    I've never read the comics. But I have to think a lot of the stronger qualities of Rick as a leader are getting lost is translation to TV. He consistently makes really bad decisions and the group blindly follows.

    I can respect that it's a real challenge for the writers to stay loyal to the source material without simply repeating the comics page-for-page. In many cases they've done a good job with their story telling. But this season, while entertaining, also suffered from the need to have characters make stupid decisions to get the chess pieces in the right place. And that diminishes Rick as a leader for those of us unfamiliar with his character in the comics.
     
  7. YR38

    YR38 Member

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    I was thinking more he said he owes them as in he owes Maggie and Glenn for bringing Enid back and getting her to actually care about the people in Alexandria
     
  8. ZombieAndTeal

    ZombieAndTeal Member

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    Yes I wondered if he meant Maggie and Glenn as 'them', seeing as Aaron said he owes 'her' being Maggie.
    Also...does anyone else when typing the name Aaron, in their head pronounce it A-A-Ron, key and peele style?? :)
     
  9. Rick's Nose

    Rick's Nose Member

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    I took it he wanted revenge for Denise
     
  10. Tyler

    Tyler Well-Known Member

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    S3 Carl is being unleashed, Rick can't control that. Ain't no Hershel around anymore.
     
  11. Marc

    Marc Well-Known Member

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    What I find funny is that they could just have kept on killing Saviours if they had some kind of teamwork. Just butcher their little patrols and outposts. Like Carol took out 5 alone. But yeah, the leadership is non exsistant. I still dream that Merle, Shane and Hershel survived somehow and comes rolling in on that Abrams tank from Season 1 with the rest of Alexandria...and the Fear the Walking Dead crew on the yacht streaming up a small river "Shane : Dangit Rick! We got this" "Merle: no one messes with my little brother. DWAYNE!" "It is Dwight!" "Shut up Dwayne!" "Hershel: Maggie! Im so happy for the baby boy you gonna get, Jesus told me in heaven" and Shane RPGs Negan away as the tank runs over half the Saviours...A boy can dream.

    Beside that, It is so funny that Carl is like 16-19 now but in the comics he is a 10 year old kid if even that. I guess they wanted to fill up the numbers and that is why Aaron and Rick jr joined in. Cause Rick knows by now that Carl can still shot pretty good. To bad Negan activated his cloning Vats project that he was the chef professor of before the walkers destroyed everything of society.
     
  12. Blueman

    Blueman Well-Known Member

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    By this time, Daryl is not in ASZ and Glenn/Sasha/Rosita has already gone after him and none has returned. Morgan is still out there looking for Carol.
    This means, Rick is really running out of people to go with him to take a sick Maggie to the Hilltop. And it is also for this reason that I think Aaron/Eugene and Carl 'have to' go along to help Rick and Abe. If it is not the impending threat of Alexandria being invaded, Gabe and Spencer might have to go along as well. All these people (except Rick/Abe) do not need to go if Daryl/Glenn/Sasha/Rosita are there and can come along.
     
  13. Marc

    Marc Well-Known Member

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    In hindsight, they should have left her in Hilltop with Glenn. Seriously. They KNOW about the complications of a pregnant woman and Denise was not a doctor of this kind.

    And to be honest, Rick and team was overzealous, cocky about this mess but what other group had these numbers? NON. The only slightly close was Termites.
     
  14. TheSlayingTaco1

    TheSlayingTaco1 Well-Known Member

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    Before the episode Carl was getting minimal screen time after "Knots Untie" and I'm like when will we see Carl again? I'm glad he had more screen time this episode. I took why he was there with Rick and co is because he knew of Denise's death in episode 15 (Why he was lookimg at the Saviors gun) he was investigating them and didn't want to see any of his family getting hurt because he owes them for saving him and having a roof over his head. He couldn't stay behind knowing his family is missing and Maggie is sick. They needed him but I do love how this episode set up the future for Carl in season 7 I'm super excited!
     
  15. ZombieAndTeal

    ZombieAndTeal Member

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    I know a little about the Carl/negan storyline in the comic, and I thought the interaction between them in the final scene set that up nicely. Just a bit weird that he was even there in the first place; that rick would agree to him being in harms way like that.
     

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