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"I didn't want this! Not you! Not like this."

Discussion in 'Episode 1007 - Open Your Eyes' started by Woodstock, Nov 21, 2019.

  1. Woodstock

    Woodstock Active Member

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    Ok, so this has been bugging me since the episode aired (and I don't believe it's been covered but in case I missed it please forgive me and point me in the right direction).

    "DANTE: Look, this place is special. And I got that right away. It It works 'cause it's a village. It takes everyone here to build, grow, and fight, raise rug rats [CHUCKLES] and heal people. Everyone carries equal weight. [SCOFFS] So, when something happens, it's all our fault, yeah? And when one of us is suffering we're here to help."

    SIDDIQ: You don't even know me, man.

    DANTE: Sure do. You're my friend. It's gonna be okay.

    DANTE: I didn't want this! Not you! Not like this."



    Source: https://transcripts.foreverdreaming.org/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=35225

    So what's the deal with Dante? I get that as a spy he has always tried his best to fit in and win the other's trust. I assume that's what he was trying to do here too, by saying all those things to Siddiq he was trying to keep up the "I'm your friend" charade. Especially since there were a few "incidents" that could undermine Siddiq's trust in him (Siddiq talking about "boundaries" in reference to Coco, the prisoner dying etc etc ). So again, I assume that Dante doesn't even mean everything he said about the place being "special" and everything that follows.

    But why does he tell Dante he "doesn't want this, not you , not like this". Are we supposed to believe that Dante actually cared about Siddiq? That he has a conscious? Because the Whisperers are ruthless. If Dante was at the barn it's because he was one of Alpha's most trusted, even more so since she sent him as a spy. He even killed the poor little old lady just to further his agenda. And he killed the prisoner so he wouldn't talk. He still seems 100% on board with Alpha. If he hadn't done all this I might actually have thought that he was sincere when he said "this place is special", that maybe he was starting to have second thoughts. In that case it would have seemed more realistic for him to say those final words to Siddiq. But considering everything we've seen so far it doesn't make any sense for him to have regrets about killing Siddiq.

    Thoughts?
     
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  2. BlackBird

    BlackBird Well-Known Member

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    A very good question, and I hope we get a good answer next episode.
    My take on it at this stage is that he was somewhat sarcastic with the speech. He's fully committed to the mission Alpha has set him on. Whether Alpha has someone close to him in captivity that ties Dante's hands, we will see. Still, killing the old lady was not in his job description for sure, that's all his initiative, so that suggest to me that he is rotten to the core. But I think the one thing he was genuine about is that he didn't really want to kill Siddiq, he couldn't help but grew to like him. Too bad. He still murdered him. And now he needs to die for what he did. I wonder if Daryl will give him the finger treatment first, or will he just confess without all that.
     
    #2 BlackBird, Nov 21, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2019
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  3. Woodstock

    Woodstock Active Member

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    I am still in denial about that. I know that a lot of people don't care about Siddiq, some were actually glad to be rid of him. Not my case. I recognized him for what he was, a side character that is good to have around. Especially being a doctor. And don't even get me started on the fact that all the doctors are getting killed off. Even Enid, I really liked her. And she went through all the training to become a doctor and then she got killed off, aaarghh!
     
    #3 Woodstock, Nov 21, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2019
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  4. Stealth

    Stealth Well-Known Member

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    All of that was strange. Also he really needed to knock out Siddiq and then make his death look like an accident or a suicide. Dante would've been better off just surrendering, or knocking Siddiq out and then fleeing.
     
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  5. Woodstock

    Woodstock Active Member

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    Exactly!!! He knew he minute he killed Siddiq that he would have to find a way to justify things.

    Which leads me to another point, if he really DID start to care for Siddiq as a friend then he didn't HAVE to kill him. He could have knocked him out and fled, leaving him alive at least. Siddiq would have told everyone he was a Whisperer but at that point Dante would have been long gone. That's why I have a problem with him saying "I didn't want this etc etc".

    I also agree about making it look like an accident or suicide. That would have been smarter on his part too, because it was the only way that he could keep his cover and not have to answer to anyone. In the current situation he has to answer to the Alexandrians AND to Alpha, who is probably going to consider him "weak" for blowing his cover (and if he knocked out Siddiq and fled he still would have had to answer to her).
     
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  6. fylimar

    fylimar Active Member

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    I liked Siddiq and Enid too and I agree, they both were killed too soon. I don't even have the impression, that I know everything there is to know about those characters. And being a doctor seems to be a bad thing in TWD.
     
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  7. Chr1s

    Chr1s Well-Known Member

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    It's a great question.

    Even if he was conflicted about doing it, he is clearly dedicated to his mission.

    He killed the whisperer in the cell to keep him from talking. Not outing Dante, he was afraid he didn't trust him enough to not betray Alpha.

    He kept up with the tainted water. And ultimately killed Siddiq.

    It's possible he genuinely liked Siddiq and maybe he does feel bad about the things he is doing. But in the end I think he's still a loyal whisperer and is willing to die for them.

    I'm really interested in what Daryl said in the preview. "We're going to trust a whisperer now?" On the surface he's talking about whatever info Gamma gave Aaron. But I'm wondering if he wasn't actually talking about Dante.
     
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  8. Neuropyramidal

    Neuropyramidal Well-Known Member

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    To be honest, I didn't have much of a problem with it. He may still be 100% dedicated to Alpha's cause, but he's also a human, and its natural to bond with someone that you spend a lot of time with. He was fine snuffing out an old lady with a pillow because he had no connection with her. But he had bonded with Siddiq. Shared war stories. And Siddiq was going through PTSD, which Dante had been through in the past [assuming that story was true]. They spent much of their time together. It just shows that he has bought into Alpha's ways, but is not necessarily a lost-cause sociopath. As for killing Siddiq instead of just knocking him out, it was probably a knee jerk decision and also in his mind he was hoping to get away with it and remain at ASZ, because he might be afraid Alpha would consider his mission a failure if he went back early.

    But yeah, its still a hard sell for me to believe he would buy into Alpha's way of life, after being a professional pre-ZA, especially if he was new to Alpha's group. That part, I think, is the stretch.
     
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  9. BlackBird

    BlackBird Well-Known Member

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    What gets me most is how he watched, even counselled Siddiq going through PTSD, whilst he was partially responsible for it. It's just horrific. I'm afraid, I'm considering him a lost cause. Unless he's got someone dear held hostage by Alpha. Even then. I think he falls into the "too far gone" category.
     
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  10. purriwinkle

    purriwinkle Well-Known Member

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    I finally brought myself to watch this a second time. That sound Dante makes...is that an involuntary vocal tic of some sort or is it deliberate? Looked like hearing that come out of Dante’s mouth at that moment, was what triggered Siddiq’s full memory recall.

    So, was it an accident or did Dante do that deliberately to test Siddiq’s reaction to determine if he remembered anything more? If it was deliberate he had to be prepared to take Siddiq out if necessary. So while he said, “I didn’t want this! Not you! Not like this!” I think it only referred to the fact that he wished this wasn’t coming to a head so soon, ruining the sweet gig he had as Alpha’s spy. The plan is to destroy Alexandria so maybe he was hoping that he’d be able to eventually wear his “friend”s face for a new mask. He deserves whatever he gets.
     
  11. Stealth

    Stealth Well-Known Member

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    I watched it again too since the first time I viewed it was in shock. I think you can read it both ways. He could've done that vocal tic on purpose, or it might've been involuntary. But if he did it on purpose then his line to Siddiq makes a little less sense. As you said though, maybe he was trying to test him? The scene is a little gray, and that's okay. All the pieces regarding Dante don't fully fit, but it's not a serious problem for me. Maybe that's part of the reason the character was played in such a weird fashion. He said inappropriate and odd things, so it leaves the audience more open to him behaving in an unorthodox manner.

    I hope though we get to see a bit more of his mindset before they kill him off. I fully expect Daryl and Co. to execute him in the midseason finale. He deserves the Martinez death, being fed to walkers.
     
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  12. purriwinkle

    purriwinkle Well-Known Member

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    The reason I felt Dante was testing him was because he pushed the whole encounter. Siddiq might have eventually remembered on his own but I presume he had been quiet in his room for awhile and Dante had to know what Siddiq’s mind set was. He pushed his way into the room even though Siddiq initially indicated he wanted to be left alone. Instead of staying by the door and talking, he came up behind him, put his hand on his shoulder briefly, then came the sound. All things that I took to be triggers.

    He was also ready to fight when he saw Siddiq’s reaction. I now believe he did this to control the moment if Siddiq showed any indication he knew Dante’s true identity. They were alone rather than have the memories return when others were around.

    His saying to Siddiq, “Not like this” means what? Like how then?
    Being eaten by the hoard as it over runs Alexandria?

    I actually can’t wait to find out more about this character. If he’s a Newbie to Alpha’s group would he consider rolling over on her and spilling everything he knows? If not, let Daryl have at his fingers and ears( oops, we seem to be short of a doctor to tend to your wounds) then let the walkers eat him.
     
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