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For those who still have some love for the show

Discussion in 'Episode 1123 - Family' started by BlackBird, Nov 14, 2022.

  1. BlackBird

    BlackBird Well-Known Member

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    I know that at this late stage of the game the new variant S1 zombies on steroids are ridiculous.

    I know that the Commonwealth has been a cliched monkey town with zero hint of realism.

    I know that the mother show should have ended years ago.

    I know that the writing has been patchy and often subpar.

    I know that there were many mistakes made along the way. Including some really painful big ones that were borderline dealbreakers for me.

    I know many storylines could have been developed better or should have been avoided at all cost.

    I know that greed and ego have sometimes gotten in the way of artistry.

    I know that the glory days of this show are long gone.

    But.

    I also know that this show has introduced me to a mesmerising parallel universe where humanity is still shown to shine as a beacon in the midst of all the shitshow and depravity.

    It has made me care deeply about a great bunch of fabulous fictional characters, many of whom I’d be honoured to call my friends or family. It was wonderful to be able to follow their lives over all these years.

    The show has also given me countless unforgettable, beautifully crafted moments on screen.

    It has made me think about society and morality in new unexpected ways.

    So. I’m still here. Loyal till the end.

    All considered, I forgive the show its faults and failings. For all the gifts it has given me over the years, I decided not to dwell on the negative. Like with most things I love, I choose to focus on the positive.

    And when I examine my heart, despite all the crap, I still ****ing love this show.

    Therefore, despite the stupid annoying variant walkers and the considerable trauma of having to watch two of my favourite girls getting badly injured, I still give this episode a 9/10.
     
    #1 BlackBird, Nov 14, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2022
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  2. lastcat3

    lastcat3 Well-Known Member

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    I don't think people would be quite as negative as they are if this franchise was simply just ending after next weeks episode. There is very little reason to keep this frachise going at this point as it is clear that the vast majority of people just aren't interested in TWD material anylonger. And since this franchise isn't ending we aren't getting any conclusions to virtually any of these characters stories after following it for basically twelve seasons. There is only one episode left and we still don't have the slightest idea as to why Daryl goes all the way across the world to do who knows what. We still don't know why Maggie and Negan choose to go to New York. Daryl and Maggie have been around since seasons 1 and 2 and instead of giving us any type of conclusion to their story in the actual show they debuted in it seems they are going to try to force people to tune into entirely different shows to get a sense of closure to their stories.

    That's not good storytelling and it's not a good way at all to treat longtime viewers.
     
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  3. Miamicuse

    Miamicuse Active Member

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    What do you mean it's going to be BIGGER AND DEADER THAN EVER!
     
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  4. Miamicuse

    Miamicuse Active Member

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    OK I have to ask, last thing Mercer said in Faith show was that the first time the F word was said on the show? I don't remember another instance.
     
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  5. BlackBird

    BlackBird Well-Known Member

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    In 11C they’ve been more generous with the F word than before. Daryl, Mercer, Negan, Rosita… it’s very refreshing that finally the characters are allowed to speak properly.
     
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  6. DNK

    DNK New Member

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    Thank you BlackBird for your wordt. They are very recognizeble to me. Also thank you for all you input and thougts over all these years. They are well appreciated.
    The show is going to end for alot of 'side' characters. The world the walking dead is only goin to extend. For me it's a big mistery wich i'm curious to explore.
    There are alot of loose ends. As an example I'm very curious about Heath. I always have a feeling he is goin to show up.
    On the storyline now. The arc of Negan is fabulous. I have never seen a character like his and how he developed. That is truely amazing and brings many aspects of real life that we need more in this world. Daryl will always be my most favorite character. I had a moment in real life were i was actually really thinking wish Daryll was here to save me but this is real life. I have to be Daryll myself and try to be Daryll for the People around me that i love. So thank you to the whole twd cast and everyone involved for that gift.

    My excuses for my english. It is not my native language
     
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  7. purriwinkle

    purriwinkle Well-Known Member

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    I too have stuck it out to the end. This is not my genre of choice either, but like you, the characters themselves and their relationships with each other are what sucked me in and kept me watching. I suspended my disbelief long ago as long as certain rules were followed because the survivors were the ones that poised the greatest threat anyways in most cases.

    This episode however had my hackles up because I didn’t care for Lydia getting bit or Judith shot. Just no. For Christ’s sake, couldn’t we get our core people out intact this close to the end without incurring major bodily harm? It’s bad enough some of the children are still missing. It’s bad enough that some are separated while others of TF went back to the CW leaving behind loved ones in Alexandria. It’s bad enough that we have super skilled walkers that are putting everyone in extreme danger. You know it’s bad when you have Negan going WTF?

    I hate to contribute to the bitching but I was hoping to have a few warm fuzzies in the last episode however it looks like quite the shit show instead. I’m only going to watch the Rick and Michonne spin off at this point but I’m hoping that the writers can give us loyal viewers some pay off as the main series ends.
     
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  8. BlackBird

    BlackBird Well-Known Member

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    This is a good thing for the minority of fans who are still excited about seeing more of some of their favourite characters. :p Damn sure I’ll be watching all three spin-offs.

    Can we also state the fact that unless a character dies, their story has no conclusion.

    I’m not sure we necessarily need to know the answers to these questions in the finale. I would be ok with them just introducing the seeds of these stories in post credits. To show life goes on. The aim of the finale is not to tell us that nothing interesting will ever happen to these people any more.

    No one is forced to watch anything. You can choose to walk away any time. The spin-offs will provide a new chapter in these characters’ lives. You can choose to travel with them further, or not. The conclusion of the mother show is likely to be that our remaining survivors will decide to stay at the Commonwealth and have a fresh start with a reasonable prospect of some more settled times to come. A sense of arrival and new beginning. It’s not meant to be a happy ever after. Life goes on with its trials and tribulations.

    Let’s wait and see first how they will end things next week. I happen to like that whilst this one door closes, three more opens. I’m not at all ready to say goodbye to these characters, and I’m happy to know I don’t have to.
     
    #8 BlackBird, Nov 15, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2022
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  9. BlackBird

    BlackBird Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for your kind words, DNK. And I’m glad to read how much this show has given you. I love that Daryl has been an inspiration for you, a source of strength. I think I’ve not made a secret of Daryl being my favourite character either, over the years! ;)

    But I admire so many of these characters, for various reasons. And I love that they’re not perfect.

    I enjoyed Heath’s character too, one of the first ones besides Aaron to recognise Team Family in Alexandria as one you’d like to be friends with. I too hope we get to see him again.

    Totally agree on Negan’s arc.

    Your words of gratitude for the gifts the show has given us, warm my heart.
     
    #9 BlackBird, Nov 15, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2022
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  10. BlackBird

    BlackBird Well-Known Member

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    I too was hoping for warm fuzzies in the finale… but I think we will get those, Purriwinkle! Sure not so much in the first half. Judith must live, surely. And Lydia will too. Like you, I don’t want a single hair put out of place on the heads of our core people. Not to mention big character deaths that some viewers seem to be craving. The only character I wouldn’t mind seeing dead is Pamela - but perhaps imprisonment would be a greater punishment for her deplorable character. Make her witness the reshaping of the CW.
     
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  11. purriwinkle

    purriwinkle Well-Known Member

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    Seeing Pamela get a measure of justice would be find by me! That would be a warm fuzzy! I’d love to see Mercer/Princess and Max/Eugene settle down as they work to restructure the CW. I’d love to see Yumiko elected to lead a more Democratic society etc. etc. but with smart walkers advancing through the city about to chow down on a defenseless people who don’t live in the estates, makes me wonder how that can be accomplished.

    Perhaps the writers can pull a satisfactory ending out of their asses and I’ll be hoping against all odds that they do. I’d like to eventually see Michonne and especially Rick come home to their children, Judith who he raised from infancy and RJ who he’s never met but is the visible manifestation of their love. They need a safe place to come home to. Hell, I’d even love to see Negan bouncing his baby on his knee! There comes a point where you just can’t stand to see these beloved characters in danger anymore. We’ve all earned some rest.
     
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  12. BlackBird

    BlackBird Well-Known Member

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    I’d love to see all this too. Also Daryl and Connie having a child or two together. (Though not holding my breath on that to actually happen on screen, ever. In my alternative TWD universe, however, they’re already married, lol.)

    All I want from the finale really is a sense of arrival and a fresh start, with a potential of a safer and easier life, and some hope for future for the children that is not just about living from one extreme crisis to the next.
     
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  13. Blueman

    Blueman Well-Known Member

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    If the finale tells us that all main characters will stay in a reformed CW and live a happily life ever after, then this will be a boring ending to me.
    Some will stay and some (like Daryl, Maggie and Negan as rumored) will, for one reason or another, will venture out (in spin-offs). Perhaps, Daryl will go out to look for Rick (and Michonne) when there is some fresh news offering hope?

    I am here to stay to the very end.
     
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  14. Stealth

    Stealth Well-Known Member

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    It's great that you're still enjoying the show. We like, or dislike, things for different reasons and they can both co-exist. I try not to be critical of a person if I like something and someone else doesn't, or vice versa. Most of art is subjective.

    I enjoyed the last two films in the Godzilla trilogy, but people can point out plot holes and too much focus on the human characters etc, but as monster films go, I enjoy it on that level. It's never going to compete with No Country for Old Men though for great cinema. And that's fine. It's not supposed to anyway.

    After I saw Once Upon a Time in Hollywood, I felt it was Tarantino's masterpiece. This is before it even won Best Picture that year. But plenty of people will toss back Jackie Brown or Pulp Fiction as being better. But I'll still die on that hill, even though I recognize the experience can be different for someone else, and it doesn't make either one of us less than the other.

    Unfortunately, I think when it comes to TV there have been too many series in recent years that have disappointed people, so it becomes aggravating. Some of us cut even less breaks because of that. It's difficult to invest X number of years in a show only to see it unravel, or blow up, as was the case with Game of Thrones. That's why I appreciate Breaking Bad, The Expanse and the Last Kingdom for doing it right, where others have failed.

    Again though, if people are still getting enjoyment out of TWD, that's great. I'm not one of them, but that's fine. Neither one invalidates the other person's own experience.
     
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  15. BlackBird

    BlackBird Well-Known Member

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    I respect that. I’m just sorry that TWD had to end like this for you.

    You know we have talked a lot about GoT and the infamous ending. Now that really came out of left field. It took me this long to calm down about it. But I’m just about able to compartmentalise the ludicrous ending now and still appreciate all that was very good about that show.

    So I’ve got a few little bin-compartments for TWD as well. I think that’s almost inevitable with such a long running show. I hope the ending won’t go there! I have a good feeling about it.

    I might of course be breathing fire in a few days, lol. Not long to wait now.
     
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  16. Miamicuse

    Miamicuse Active Member

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    I guess we all have different levels of attachments to the show, and that's OK. I too started watching since season 1, so one thing we all have in common, is that we all invested quite a bit of time watching the show, following the stories and the characters along the way. I sort of starting to drop out after season 8, still watched every episode, but mostly on a delay and catch up instead of catching it when it airs first on Sunday nights.

    I don't have a problem with character deaths, as long as it makes sense and advances the story. In other words, I am ok with anyone dying, and I don't have any special attachments to any character, I don't wish for so and so to make it or so and so to get together with so and so. If it is part of the story telling, fine. I don't want someone to die just for the shock value either. For example, if Judith dies in the next episode, so be it, IF the writer decides that's what it takes for Maggie to forgive Negan. Negan already saved Hershel, so that counts for something, then Maggie heard Negan's "confession" to Ezekiel about wanting to do something right for once when it counts, and may be Judith taking a bullet for Maggie, and Judith before she checks out tells Maggie what Carl wants, and if that is what causes Maggie and Negan to eventually become a team...OK, I'll bite. I am even OK with Carol gone if it requires it, not because Melissa decides to not to be in the Daryl show.

    But I would like to see the show ends. They are already on season 11 part C, and the finale is an extended episode, so they have plenty of time to tell the story fully and completely and wrap it up.
     
  17. lastcat3

    lastcat3 Well-Known Member

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    For me the irritating thing about the current state of this franchise is that it didn't use to be a Z Nation like series that seemed to be more of a horror based comedy than a show that you could truly take seriously. Seasons 1-5 (and many would include season 6 in there as well) TWD was considered to be a realistic portrayal of how individuals would act in a post apocalyptic world. There was very little humor involved in the show.

    THe show used to be like this.



    And



    How do you go from a show that used to be about the effect the TWD world had on little kids like Lizzie and what the adults felt like they needed to do to handle the situation to what we have seen in season 11 where they are now dressing up like zombies to scare little kids for fun?

    How does that happen? I'm serious when I say the show now doesn't even feel like it is in the same universe as TWD seasons 1-5.

    Back when this forum was still a real active place we used to make fun of Z Nation for its portrayal of an apocalyptic world. Well that is pretty much exactly what TWD is now.
     
    #17 lastcat3, Nov 15, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2022
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  18. Stealth

    Stealth Well-Known Member

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    I was able to compartmentalize Dexter. The first 4 seasons were great and if they ended on the final episode of Season 4 it'd be regarded as one of the best TV series. Next few seasons were fair and then they had a cringeworthy final season, that was the worst of all time until GOT. The only good thing about Dexter was that it spawned some of the best memes I've ever seen. The show was just ridiculous in the end.

    Unbelievably, they returned last year to try and "fix" the final season, with the original showrunner who wasn't part of the ending debacle. It started out great, just like the series of old, and then it crashed and burned over the last couple of episodes. I don't think any series will match them, TWO terrible endings.

    I can compartmentalize the early seasons of TWD though. Maybe they just should've ended it when they reached Alexandria.

    You have to watch House of the Dragon. You'll enjoy it. My only real complaint was the pacing was a bit too quick this season, but I read the book, so an non-book reader might not be as bothered by that.
     
  19. Stealth

    Stealth Well-Known Member

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    I think Z Nation eventually embraced themselves as being a comedy/parody of the zombie apocalypse. Maybe they were trying to take a semi-serious tilt in the initial season, but it didn't last long.

    I'm betting one of the spinoffs AMC does is going to go full World War Z with swarming zombies. They're dipping their toe into ripping off that film's concept in the final season of TWD. I'm betting they go all out, maybe with Daryl's spinoff since he's going to be in another country.
     
  20. Stealth

    Stealth Well-Known Member

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    My guess is that Carol survives since I think they wrapped filming prior to Melissa deciding she didn't want to be a part of Carol's European vacation with Daryl.
     

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