Remember, they said they lost 14 people putting up the wall and they lost 4 people doing runs recently. that was probably the most capable 18 people they had. Even the construction crew was led by a coward who would have abandoned that woman to die.

 

3 things that irritated me...
Rick behaving out of character with Jesse and unreasonably towards Pete.
No mention of Father Gabriel's comments. Like it never happened. Although she wasn't seen, at least Tara was referred to!
Jesse, who's spent years coming to terms with her husband's behaviour, changing her mind set on the say so of a man she's known for 5 minutes...Realistic? No. Far more likely to tell him to get the hell out of there.
However, I liked Sasha and the other girls bonding. And their action scenes/Michonne's flashbacks. And Glenn was good again.

 

How come no one has complained about that $h**** annoying, unnecessary, irritating "Run Mix" music in the beginning of this episode? Did we really need that?
Also, yes, where is baby-Judith? Not that her character development matters. And where is Maggie and is she going to do something about Father whiney-pants-"Judas"-back-stabber. And why did he betray the group anyway, after they saved his a$$ multiple times?
Nice to finally hear more than 2 words from Rosita, although still can't figure out why her and Michonne went outside the walls armed with only a little knife and one pistol :zombies_confused: They used to be smarted than that.
And I'm not even going to mention about Rick going full-shane. Although Pete is kind of a creep. How about this: piss Sasha off some more and then lock her in a room with Pete.
Afterwards maybe they can send nicholas and gabriel on a supply run together, just the two of them, to go finally find that pasta maker for Mrs. Nedurmyer.

ps - I might have accidentally killed Otis

 

1. 2 of them were walkers
2. yes
3. because they're all about transparency, and also because the video camera battery is getting low, so it's good to only get one side of the story

 

Everything you said was dead-on-balls accurate. Here here!

 

Genius post... slow round of applause!

 

Originally Posted by ColorsVersatile
The lack of coherence pisses me off.

"In real life", a community like the ASZ just COULDN'T be weak. (And no offense, but a group like Rick's which is struggling so much to settle somewhere on their own can't be "strong"). Setting up and managing such a community... it takes brains, arms, courage, skills, leadership, fraternity! You don't get just to be "lucky" when you're several years into the apocalypse!

But they are depicted as the weak ones when, logically, they should be the total opposite.

Only for the "sake" of the storyline.
To me, this is bad writing.

You nailed it with this extremely rare, yet brilliantly concise and accurate assessment of the entire show's basis for "complaints and criticism". Couldn't have been said better; this entire section of the forum is based on the example of incoherence and inconsistency you pinpointed so well.

 

1. Count me in for that complaint. That scene and the song was annoying as sh*t, no matter what weird explanation it may've had.

2. Agreed. Where the hell is Maggie who overheard the backstabbing of the century that could get them all killed? Call me crazy, but maybe save a few minutes of Sasha's zombie hunting screen-time to show that infinitely more important conversation between Maggie and... I don't know, her group OR Deanna in ticking time-bomb fashion!?

3. He's clearly proven himself to be a narcissistic, cowardly backstabbing, murdering "father" who embodies the epitome of irony, for someone who alleges to be a messenger of "god". There's no rationale or reason in the world that would explain his betrayal other than his twisted, selfish, god-fearing self-preservation (when it's "Satan" he should be worried about if he believes in that stuff). Since he's a massively whitewashed villain and overall terrible person, he's doing what he does best: sacrificing those who selflessly saved him to now save himself.

4. Simple yet genius idea that is eons more logical than what actually happened in the episode. #stupidwriters

5. You had me at "Nicolas and Gabriel on a supply run". Best idea in the history of poetic justice, let alone in this show. I'd kill to watch that scene.

Top Priority of the above: Gabriel is a massive Trojan Horse that is long overdue for a gory, painful death by being deserted; should've put him in Noah's horrific exit so the world could finally say "Thank you God!"

 

I would like my english were as good as yours and my brain work like yours does. But that's not the case, so I quote you and take your words as mine.

 

There's no way that a cop who has been through a zombie apocalypse and fought hand to hand for years on the run for his life would be fighting for more that two seconds with a drunk surgeon who doesn't ever go outside the walls because he's medically too important.

It'd be a haymaker swing that Rick would duck or block and then an arm-bar control move to take the drunk down.

Oh wait, that's not enough drama. Forget it, let's have them go at it like the fight scene in They Live.

 

I agree the opening scene music (yes I know it was part of the remember our son mourning the loss) but to me it threw off almost the whole episode. It was a good episode, maybe just the build up for finale. But editing/timing something was off a bit IMO. First time I ever had that feeling in all 5 season's.

 

Pete was bigger/taller and not very drunk at the moment. He`s also had a lot of practice on his wife. :hatchet:

 

It`s annoying when the writers/producers underestimate their viewers.

Rick`s been giving the speech of "blablabla you don´t know what the world is now blabla blabla you will not survive blabla you have not been out there blabla" and Deanna and co going "huh what" for THE LAST SEVERAL EPISODES.

Can`t we just have Rick say ONE logical and weight carrying sentence that would make ASZ ppeople see the light? Please? Instead of this round, empty and dramatic "yaddayadda you don`t know what`s it like" talk. PLEASE. We have a brain. Honestly.

 

But isn't that the whole point of Deanna's role in the story though? That she's so stuck in her ways and stubborn that she won't listen to Rick? I feel like it's gonna take something big for her to really open her eyes. Not just words...

 

That would be more believable if we had actually seen Rick or someone else from his group try to reason with her. So far all we have seen is some empty and emotional babbling. They could have made a short scene with Rick giving detailed accounts about what has actually happened to their group and then Deanna go "nah." Or something like that.

But yes, you are probably right about something big making her see things the way they are.

 

Calm before the storm...

 

I think Maggie could persuade Deanna about life outside. Heck, we don't know if anyone mentioned any specifics about their experiences. There's a promo trailer that shows Deanna, Reg, and Maggie on a front porch, and Maggie is supporting Rick, saying he over-reacted but he's lost so much; they all have. Deanna gives a slow glare and says, "What you've lost?" referring to her son. Maggie gazes at for a moment and then replies simply, "We've lost more." At which point I shot a cross-bolt through my TV. First of all, way to just come out and tacitly minimize Deanna's loss. Secondly, this would be a pretty damn good time to say something like, "I know. And I don't have kids, so I can't even imagine what that loss must feel like. But I do know what it feels like to watch your father be beheaded, by a human, while you're powerless to do anything. And Sasha knows what it's like to lose her partner to a walker bite but not before he was kidnapped by cannibals who ate his leg. If you need more examples, I have them. I just want you to understand that while we may seem over-reactive, assuming safety has gotten some of us killed." It would take someone like her to speak in coherent, non-gun-waving fashion. If Deanna does know all of this and still minimizes the risk, then she deserves whatever she gets. I just feel like Rick is constantly denigrating and maybe even hating the ASZ residents because they don't know how dangerous it is, but nobody will tell them how dangerous it is: "Look at those idiots, driving right along, not even caring about the bridge that washed out 5 miles up the road." "Rick, maybe we should tell them about the bridge." "Nah, that would make too much sense."

 

Yeah, I know. I think there might be something up with all those W's carved on walkers we keep repeatedly seeing. I think that might be a clue that something's going on where people carve W's into walker heads. I mean we've only seen a small number of references to it:

- it's all over the place at ShitWire estates
- we glimpse it somewhere else on a random wandering zombie
- Daryl draws our attention to it during the meeting of the Gang of Three
- Daryl further draws our attention to it during the horrible tortured women tied to a tree scene
- one of zombies near the fence that Sasha takes down has a W

You know what? I'm starting to think there's a pattern here and this is more than coincidence.

With stuff like this the writers seem to be getting dumber rather than smarter. I think it was a big mistake to take Gimple off writing. He arguably wrote the best episodes of the show.

I just watched Clear on a rerun channel and comparing an episode like that, that makes you want to burst into tears and has such emotional power, to this episode where all through it you're thinking "that's just stupid".

 

Clear definitely set the high bar for the series. It's amazing. Gimple is a much better writer than he is showrunner, and the current writers aren't as strong. If you had an equally mediocre showrunner as him on TWD, and then had Gimple instead writing more episodes I think you'd have a stronger overall series.

Lennie James and Andrew Lincoln also have great onscreen chemistry, so if they can get James as a regular for at least a season that alone would raise the quality of the show significantly too. That' what I'm hoping for in Season 6.

 

That is why I cannot wait for them to do something really out of the left field and just kill Rick off. At this point, I cannot stand him. Rick's heart is in the right place but so far, he is only an antagonizing element that makes the rest look bad. I am pretty sure Michonne knocking him out was for his own good before he escalate the situation beyond control. Rick is becoming a loose cannon like Shane, as some other people have pointed out, and ultimately he will pose more of a threat than the walkers themselves.

Rick's bloodied face makes me wonder if that is not an allusion to Masque of the Red Death...they built the walls up to keep out the plague, only to trap themselves inside with something worst.