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Game of Thrones(SPOILERS)

Discussion in 'Television Shows' started by Killermolls, May 17, 2012.

  1. Stealth

    Stealth Well-Known Member

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    The neverending delay on Winds of Winter worries me because I feel he's lost the creative energy for Song of Ice and Fire. My two biggest concerns are:

    • Seeing the characters he created played by real life actors has skewed his approach because he now sees them not in his mind's eye, but Emilia as Dany, Kit as Jon etc
    • Maybe his writing style or emphasis has changed. I really enjoyed Fire and Blood but it reads more like a history book where he doesn't need to get the characters perfectly done. Some of it is based on rumor, mystery, Mushroom's accounts etc. It also fits more into the screenplay style approach that he's going to be doing with his 5 year contract.
    After all these years I think he's just not extremely happy with what he's created for Winds, or it would've been done by now. He said the pandemic was great for completing it, but yet here we are a year later and no end date in sight.

    This quote from his blog in February is telling and I think it shows he's not pleased with the content:

    "I wrote hundreds and hundreds of pages of THE WINDS OF WINTER in 2020. The best year I’ve had on WOW since I began it. Why? I don’t know. Maybe the isolation. Or maybe I just got on a roll. Sometimes I do get on a roll.

    I need to keep rolling, though. I still have hundreds of more pages to write to bring the novel to a satisfactory conclusion."

    Hundreds and hundreds of pages would mean we have thousands after all these years. So he's either writing, scrapping most of it and rewriting again, or it means (from the one optimistic angle) that some of this is "A Dream of Spring" content.

    I hope it's the latter, but I fear it's not.
     
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  2. purriwinkle

    purriwinkle Well-Known Member

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    Those are interesting observations. You could be right that seeing the show played out on the screen messed with his creative muse if you will. Although they say he doesn’t care what his “fans” think, I don’t believe he’s totally immune to the public’s response to the show. It may have changed his plot trajectory and he either wasn’t happy, as you suggest, or certain aspects were no longer coming together which has proved frustrating. OR like you say, he’s trying to complete both books which obviously is a daunting task considering the scope of tying up all his complicated story lines but gains more time with the new deal and keeps his audience placated by keeping them enmeshed in Westeros.

    By holding on to his manuscript he can then release them, as we’ve discussed before, as half books to keep us on the hook for more and to keep him relevant. That could backfire however. It could get to the point people no longer care.
     
    #8222 purriwinkle, Mar 30, 2021
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2021
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  3. Stealth

    Stealth Well-Known Member

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    I'm sure his publisher is even more aggravated than his readers at this stage. You know they had to suggest half books at some point too. I could see him pushing back on that because some of what he's working on now, might change what he's written before, and he wants the final product set.

    I've begun reading the "Dragonbone Chair" by Tad Williams. It's the "Memory, Sorrow and Thorn" trilogy that Martin said inspired him to write A Song of Ice and Fire. Some people who've read the series say it's changed their outlook on Martin a bit. They feel he's taken a lot from this trilogy. I'm just about 70 pages in. No real similarities yet. The throne is huge and made of dragonbone, similar to the one made of swords in Martin's series. No big deal there for me in terms of "stealing" content.

    I don't find his writing as compelling yet either, but if the novel is decent enough I'll finish the series.
     
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  4. X-HUNTER

    X-HUNTER Well-Known Member

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    I do not care what GRMM says, the vast negative outcry of the GOTs finale must have had an impact on his writing as well as his psyche. He is probably trying out other endings, but the damage is already done. GRRM should have never allowed the TV series to overtake his books, as it is, the show has stolen the magic from his future ice and fire releases, and many fans are still reeling from the bitter taste the finale have left in their mouths.
     
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  5. Jama

    Jama Moderator
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    That ending was so horribly executed. It really puts a stain on GRRM's legacy and the expectations of any future books mixed, assuming he finishes them. He's kind of in a no win situation. If he finishes these books sooner rather than later, is the bad taste of what happened with the show's ending going to negatively influence readers? I believe it will.

    Alternatively, if he finishes those books (sooner or later) and he knocks it out of the park with the plot, ties up loose ends and repairs the story if you will, then that's good. I guess. But then I'll really REALLY want a series reboot that incorporates the better ending, and I don't see that happening in the near future if at all.
     
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  6. southernlady

    southernlady Well-Known Member

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  7. Stealth

    Stealth Well-Known Member

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    The show was so great in those early years. I disagreed with some of D&D's choices, but the quality was strong through 4 seasons. It became wobby with the Dorne plot in Season 5 going off the rails.

    In retrospect I wish they had simply ended it with Season 6, Jon becomes King, Cersei is Queen and Dany is on her way to Westeros. They could've said the story would be picked up down the line when (yes lol) Martin finished the books. It could've given them at least some time to consider an ending while picking up other stories from Martin's universe. It would've worked for D&D too because they'd still have their reputations intact.
     
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