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If shane was still alive

Discussion in 'Episode 416 - A' started by Walker3895, Apr 21, 2014.

  1. HondaS2kXD

    HondaS2kXD Well-Known Member

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    I'll write my theory on the basis that,
    Shane was having a genuine epiphany as Rick killed him, and would have let Rick live.

    First of all, no gunshot would have meant no horde of walkers, so they very well could have stayed on the farm.

    Had the horde found its way to the farm anyways, they might have escaped together because Shane would have come back to the house with Rick, collecting Carl along the way. So, everyone would have escaped together, meaning Andrea would not have ended up with michonne, much less at Woodbury.

    Eventually, finding the prison, Shane's first major effect would have happened. I hated just about every single thing about Shane-- his affair with Lori. His personality. His complete lack of subtlety. His stupid ****ing always-open douchebag mouth. The list goes on. But i DO agree with him on "foreign policy." I agree with him on Randall. And I think if he had been alive, he would have definitely been more firm with the inmates. Granted that might mean he would have killed axel and Oscar too... But Andrew would have been killed which could have meant t-dog and Lori would still be alive. Maybe in submitting to Rick, though, he would have cooled down a bit. And maybe that might have meant Oscar and axel might have been kept alive. Who knows? I'm going with Andrew would have died but axel and Oscar were kept alive. Maybe even tiny.

    Now... Michonne... Having never met up with Andrea, we can't really guess at where she would have gone. So, two separate theories:
    1. She ended up at Woodbury somehow. Got suspicious. Pissed in the governor's cornflakes. Got chased away by Merle, who met with Glenn and Maggie the same way as before. Basically, exactly what happened, minus Andrea being a retard.
    2. Comic version. Shows up at the prison out of nowhere, saves somebody outside the gates. Gets taken in. Team prison sees the helicopter to down, chase after it, get captured, bad shit goes down.

    And, on the governor. Shane would have taken part in the assault for sure. But we can pretty much assume things would have gone the same way. Maybe a few extra woodburians would have been killed.

    Back at the prison after the initial assault, Shane would have been much more focused on fortification and arming up. And because Lori didn't die because Andrew did, Rick would have not had to chase his hallucinations. So, Shane could work on the defenses while "Clear" happened. Not much of a difference, but who knows, every little bit counts.

    I DO think Shane would have had none of "arrow to the doorpost." That scene would have gone like this:
    Rick: here is a map. We draw up boundaries and stick to them.
    Governor: no, I am still a useless twat. I'm only here to accept your surrender and share dull stories to try and humanize myself because I am a twisted bastard.
    Rick: well, that's bullshit.
    Gov: I brought whiskey.
    Rick: I brought friends.
    [shane, Tdog, comic Andrea, Daryl, merle, and possibly tiny all launch a synchronized attack, killing them all.]

    Assuming that DIDN'T happen for whatever reason, we'll skip ahead to the governor's first assault. It would have most likely happened in a very similar way, but with one or two exceptions. Firstly, Shane would have stood up for Carl, agreeing that he did what needed to be done. Rick might have still wanted to talk to carl about he way he carried himself afterwards, but carl would have kept his gun. Also, he might not have been so trusting of Karen. But because I'm running with a more moderated Shane in my theory (my theory, my rules, dammit) we'll assume they would have taken in the woodburites just like what happened.

    Aaaand, season 4... Carl would have moved closer to his father like what happened already, but would have learned more about guns and have maybe gotten a more active role in the group. More importantly, Rick would have never had to deal with Hershel's pacifism bullshit and would have been more balanced-- to quote carol, "you can be a farmer, Rick. You can't JUST be a farmer." So, Rick and Carl are more hardened, and perhaps not quite as close as they were, but there's still plenty of time to fix that in "after." I don't see Shane having much of an impact on the sickness arc, so I'll skip to Too Far Gone. Firstly, because Rick and Carl never pacified, they might have taken a more offensive strategy against one-eye-Bri. Rick might have gone to the fence to run a distraction while Shane led team prison in Carl's plan: (which I agree with) synchronize aims, then open fire at the same time. Violence of action is a powerful thing: overwhelm the enemy and kill them before they know what's going on. Might have even taken out the tank driver. BUUUUT... Assuming Shane was more submitted to Rick than I predicted, too far gone would have played out exactly like it did, except Lori and maybe Judith would have also died, because, like kirkman, I am a truly dark and terrible person. :)

    4b: we can assume Shane would have stuck with carl during the fight at he prison, and therefore escaped with them. After would have been a different episode. Maybe rather than directly ranting at Rick, Carl might have talked about it with Shane behind rick's back. Shane would have told carl he'd been down that road, and it was wrong. OR Shane would have agreed with carl and it could have reinstated their rift from season 2, but now fighting only over Carl rather than Carl and Lori. I'm going with the latter theory. Rick and Shane at odds again. But carl would have the same reconciliation with Rick at the end of the episode-- shane and carl would have taken turns on watch outside. So, carl would have been more aligned with Rick than in s2.

    In claimed, we'll assume Shane stayed behind with Rick to have a nice argument. Think 18 miles out, but in a house. The claimers would have come in and it would have played out about the same way, but Shane might have been faster to fire than Rick was in the end, so there may or may not have been a gunfight right then and there. But because I'm lazy, well just assume they ran away the same as what happened.

    In "A," is where I think Shane would've made the biggest difference. I think Shane might've been too forceful in trying to make a move, and might have gotten himself and somebody else killed when held at gunpoint by the claimers. Or maybe he could have done what Abraham did in the comics. Who knows. I say that a lot, don't I?

    At terminus, Shane could have made a big difference again. I think if there were five of them instead of just 4, they might have decided to split up and send one or two of them in as scouts. In this theory, I'd guess Shane and Daryl, because they're self-aware badasses and the only two who the other three would consider letting go. So, we might be looking at a very different s4 cliffhanger. We might be anticipating Rick, Carl, and Michonne staging outside terminus ready to help the group escape, or maybe just skip straight to killing the termites the way they killed the hunters in the comics. Carl could take Andrea's sniper role. Michonne could take Abe's.

    Well, shit. I actually would've liked to have seen that. This is the first time I've ever been sad Shane died. Neat-o.
     
  2. Walker3895

    Walker3895 Member

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    Very creative...I'm glad i made you miss shane
     
  3. tink

    tink Well-Known Member

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    How does Shane have anything to do with episode 416? He's been dead for a couple of seasons now.
     
  4. Taeyeon'sBF

    Taeyeon'sBF Well-Known Member

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    LOL black magic.
     
  5. ShamblingCorpse

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    If Shane killed Rick without drawing suspicion on himself (highly unlikely) at the very best they would have died between seasons 2 and 3. Even if he managed to keep everyone alive and together he wouldn't have had the foresight to try and take the prison, and they were all dying a slow death before the prison.

    He would have provoked the Governor into an open fight, he wouldn't have gone to rescue Glenn and Maggie, I doubt that he would have welcomed Michonne.

    His bull in a china shop approach to leadership would have gotten everyone killed by putting them in a situation that they couldn't have escaped. He didn't have the long term thinking ability or the personality to make good decisions that will keep the group safe as a whole.
     
  6. Cody V

    Cody V Member

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    If Shane is leading the group with Rick out of the picture, they don't end up at the prison right away. Shane's group wouldn't be as intact as Rick's group as there were major trust issues with some members of the group and Shane. Shane, Lori, Carl, Daryl, Carol are all that remains intact of the group. If anything they end up at Woodbury with the Governor and Shane ends up being a chief henchman (Let's assume they meet up with Andrea and Michonne here as well). Possibly, they have the supplies they need at Woodbury to successfully guide Lori through child birth and she lives. Shane mentors Carl and helps Carl believe that his feelings of "being a monster" are not bad, but just survival instinct. In a supply run for the Governor, they run across the prison and clear it with no problem, but they likely put down most of the surviving inmates that were still there. They create a kind of twin community between the prison and Woodbury with no bloodshed between the two. It could happen.
    :hatchet:
     
  7. segaz

    segaz New Member

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    Shane should have just calmed down and backed his buddy Rick up. Not everyone who is unstable needs to die in a paranoid bloodlust. But somehow people think it's more 'interesting' if their unstability gets them killed rather than having them 'learn' from it.

    Think about it. Everyone who was questionably 'evil', such as Shane, Lizzie, or Merle is dead. Not one of them was given a chance to come around and really develop more as a character.
    I don't count Carol, because they always presented her as firm. Maybe she wasn't always capable when they first met her, but she was firm when killing Karen and David that this was the best thing to do, for the sake of the group.
    In fact they just accepted her back in WITH these flaws, they've accepted that 'yeah she's right', which is why they had Tyreese see her kill Lizzie, because apparantly there was no hope for Lizzie, and it's best to put her out of her misery, so at least Tyreese can understand that it might have been neccessary to kill Karn and David.

    This means that the show is not trying to present Carol as a 'villain', but just someone who did what was neccessary. That's why she is alive.


    the other 'villains' in the group are all dead. Even Merle, and he was actually starting to turn a corner. But nope, he's still a bad guy, so he has to pay for what he did.

    I do love the walking dead, but this pattern annoys me.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. kennyisalive94

    kennyisalive94 Well-Known Member

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    I'll admit, it would've been nice to see more Shane. But it would have to be a completely different story than what we got.
     
  9. jj_vsp

    jj_vsp Well-Known Member

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    Yeah quite a bit of a different story it would be. ;)
     
  10. Alec96

    Alec96 Well-Known Member

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    I agree - It would have been interesting seeing him survive into season 3. Overall though, it would have taken away necessary development for Rick, Daryl, and Carl (even the group as a whole). He was always going to die. It was nice that they extended that time from the end of season 1, to the end of season 2.
     
  11. LadyGrimes

    LadyGrimes Well-Known Member

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    Towards the end there, Shane wasn't very level headed and too far gone. He made a lot of decisions based on impulse and ultimately would have led to getting people killed. Even if he had succeeded in killing Rick, that alone would be enough for the others not to trust him in fear of being killed as well. So I think the group would have eventually split up, or someone else would end up killing Shane.
     
  12. Shane357

    Shane357 Active Member

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    For the sake of this arguement,
     
  13. Shane357

    Shane357 Active Member

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    I also think Merle might still be alive, because Rick might've been smarter than Shane in the end, but if Shane was still alive, he's definitely smart enough to reason with him... "Rick... just because you hand over Michonne, doesn't mean he's going to leave us."... so Merle wouldn't have gone out and tried to kill the Governor. By 'Arrow On the Doorpost', gov. would most likely be dead, as long as they all took him by surprise while Rick was talking.

    (That's assuming Michonne lived long enough to get into the prison, and Lori died instead of Rick/Shane.)
     
  14. AnnieOakley

    AnnieOakley Active Member

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    I'm re-watching these episodes, and I almost never read really long posts, no less about Shane hypotheticals, but damn. I was reading your alternate Shane-Rick version like I was watching a magic show on top of a unicorn. You deserve a zillion "likes" for this storyline and from your quality alone, would be a much better TV writer than some of the fools who actually have the job. And not just the writing quality, but the actual logistics of how the story would've altered as well. Nobel prize for literature for you.
     
    #34 AnnieOakley, Dec 4, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2015
  15. HondaS2kXD

    HondaS2kXD Well-Known Member

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    Well, I wouldn't have faked Glenn's death. so, there's that. ;)

    Lol. Jk. I'm still a Gimple fanboy.

    Thanks though.
     

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