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LMFAO - Alternate Solutions for Lizzie's case

Discussion in 'Episode 414 - The Grove' started by RatFeeder, Mar 18, 2014.

  1. RatFeeder

    RatFeeder Member

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    Am I really reading that people suggest a better solution for Lizzie would have been for her to be tied up? BWAHAHAHA. In what way would that be more humane? "We are going to tie you up and keep you confined until you see things our way". Yeah, because THAT is going to make her like humans more. She already is obsessed with walkers and some of you want to tie her up?

    I'm not saying there couldn't have been something else done, but AFAIK it was based on a storyline in the comics. However, should they have chosen something else, I don't think tying her up, subduing her, would have halped her mental state any.
     
  2. ShamblingCorpse

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    She wouldn't have understood it at all. She would have thought that it was because Carol and Tyreese were mad at her, not for her own safety.

    Look at how badly she freaked out when Carol killed her "friend", and how upset she was when she thought Carol was mad because she pointed a gun. Not because she killed her sister or was going to kill a baby, but because she pointed a gun.

    Mentally she wouldn't have handled being restrained or confined, she would have went even crazier than she already was because she wouldn't understand or grasp what was happening or why.
     
  3. highway234

    highway234 Member

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    there's no reason to think she couldn't be rehabilitated or that her illness wouldn't eventually fix itself. manic depression tends to resolve itself after a few months (though it usually comes back later), adolescent schizophrenia often clears up once the victim becomes an adult. lizzie was a child. children's ideation is usually pretty malleable.

    anyway, even if she couldn't be rehabilitated, i'm still not clear why keeping her confined is less humane than killing her. killing her is pretty much the ultimate in inhumane. confining her or leaving her at the house with the means to take her own life if she so chose are both better options than killing her.
     
  4. len112

    len112 Member

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    They could have tied her to a chair for a day facing a dead tied up Mika , cruel I know but less cruel than a bullet in the head . Your dead sister trying to eat your face for day would bring her to her senses , if not then shoot them both .
     
  5. Benrai2k

    Benrai2k Active Member

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    I don't see how you think leaving a mentally ill childd alone to be ripped apart is a better option than a quick clean bullet?
     
  6. WunTuBlame

    WunTuBlame Member

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    Let her become a walker, chop off her arms and jaw. It doesn't sound humane but it would be what she wanted.

    Then again people would be all whiny about child mutilation. THERE'S NO WINNING WITH YOU GUYS!

    lol, all jokes aside, how many psychiatrists survived thus far?
     
  7. Machete

    Machete Active Member

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    I am growing deeply concerned with all the "Carol shouldn't have shot Lizzie" posts.

    Could she have been saved? Maybe, with medication and years of therapy, and a trained psycologist.

    None of those things were readily available though...

     
  8. STRINGS

    STRINGS Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
     
  9. tink

    tink Well-Known Member

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    Who exactly would rehabilitate her? I haven't seen many trained psychiatric personnel around. And mental illness doesn't just "fix itself". Manic depression does not resolve itself, you just go through periods of mania followed by periods of depression - both of which are hard to get through even with medication and psychiatric care, neither of which are available to Lizzie. Childhood onset schizophrenia doesn't "clear up" and actually has a very poor prognosis when compared to adolescent/adult onset - which also, by the way, don't "clear up". You can possibly manage it with the right drugs, which is a trial and error process, but once you have it you have it for life.
     
  10. sonoftupac

    sonoftupac Member

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    Im glad she got killed. I wish they didnt kill her though, i wish they had a zombie bite her so she gets the zombie fever and learns first hand that zombies arent humans.
     
  11. E_Harris

    E_Harris Member

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    Yeah tying her up and leaving her there wouldn't help anything. I think the reason that some people have a hard time with what happened(and myself included) is just the fact she's a young girl. The idea of trying to help her didn't really seem like an option for them which was disappointing. Maybe it's wishful thinking on my part but I'd like to imagine that at some point Lizzie would realize what she did to her sister and that would help her come to grips with reality. I think that's the difference between Lizzie and someone who just went crazy. She has this moment that might trigger something in her mind down the road. I think that by getting rid of Lizzie Carol and Tyrese fail to take the realistic responsibilty of being adults. That means to take on the harder responsibilities in order to care for the kids. And especially when it comes to the kids every possibility needs to be considered.
     
  12. highway234

    highway234 Member

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    there's some chance she could survive. plus, as i keep saying, i'd leave her with the means to take her own life in case of walkers. they were just contemplating staying in the house for good, so they could hardly think, in the same breath, that leaving lizzie there is a guaranteed death sentence.
     
  13. highway234

    highway234 Member

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    yeah, i'm growing similarly concerned with all the posts justifying the calculated execution of a child.
     
  14. highway234

    highway234 Member

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    lol, i love this logic. "i wish she'd turned into a zombie so she could learn first-hand that zombies don't learn anything."
     
  15. highway234

    highway234 Member

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    that's just not true. some forms of psychosis are chronic, others clear up with treatment, others clear up after a time whether treated or not.
     
  16. Benrai2k

    Benrai2k Active Member

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    I think the point of the story though was in line with being "Too far gone", I don't believe she ever would survive. Which is a shame cause if she could have got out of this walker obsession she could have been very valuable. Like I said though, even if she was left with means to take her own life, and like you said yourself - she'd probably just let walkers get her, to be like them.

    They contemplated living there as a group - working as a unit. Leaving one mentally disturbed child who loves walkers is basically a death sentence for her.

    Why aren't you concerned she executed her sister and almost the baby?
     
  17. Machete

    Machete Active Member

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    I don't think anyone "likes" that is happened. But we can see how it was necessary. Giving her treatment wasn't an option.
     
  18. Benzel

    Benzel Member

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    She wouldn't take her own life under threat from walkers. She would embrace it because she was completely unhinged.

    Leaving her and passing the buck onto the poor folks that find her is just as bad. You're essentially leaving a ticking time bomb for someone else. She was too far gone. Everything in that episode should have illustrated that clearly enough.
     
  19. Mr Samhain

    Mr Samhain Member

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    There were no alternative solutions. Maybe in the real world she'd be able to get treatment that may have a positive effect, but in the world of TWD nobody has that option anymore.

    The fact that she apologized for aiming her gun at Carol and not for killing Mika said it all. She didn't get it, and that's why she was so dangerous.

    I also agree that just leaving her there is far less humane than what Carol did. Carol killed her in the most humane way possible, actually. Leaving her behind to become more of a danger to herself and others wouldn't have solved a thing.
     
  20. RatFeeder

    RatFeeder Member

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    Well you can disagree with how Carol decided to end it, but concerning the bolded part of your statement - really? We are talking hypothetically in the ZA, correct? There is no sense of normalcy for her to get to, her mental state would have only gotten worse. I'm not sure where you are getting that manic depression fixes itself, that is just not correct. If you're talking about adolescent schizophrenia, I'll let you read something from an study with cited sources:

    "Although antipsychotic drugs remain the cornerstone of treatment in adolescent schizophrenia, all young patients with schizophrenia require a multi-modal treatment package that includes pharmacotherapy, family and individual counseling and education about the illness, and assessment of social and educational needs"

    So no drugs available, no counseling available, what would make you think she could get any better? In a perfect world, yes, she could probably be rehabilitated, but this is most certainly not a perfect world. The choice Carol made was absolutely fudged up, but I think that speaks to the desperate measures people have come to as well as them doing things they couldn't even fathom doing before the ZA.
     

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