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Madison Clark

Discussion in 'Fear The Walking Dead Season 1' started by Zed Sanford, Aug 24, 2015.

  1. Neuropyramidal

    Neuropyramidal Well-Known Member

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    Me too, I was thinking the exact same thing. I thought we'd have an interesting scene between Nick and the psychiatrist. Oh well, plenty of interesting scenes to come. ;)
     
  2. and138

    and138 Well-Known Member

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    IMO I think whether the police were doing the right thing or not is kind of beside the point. The scene revealed a lot about all the characters and the family dynamic. Madison is a pragmatic, take-charge type of person who has a weakness when it comes to her addict son. She has gone to find him at the hospital or police station many times before, and she knows the drill and what his rights are when it comes to being questioned, which is why she didn't miss a beat when shooing the cops out.
     
  3. and138

    and138 Well-Known Member

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    This. She knows what's what.
     
  4. Neuropyramidal

    Neuropyramidal Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, she actually said "its in the genes", but I assumed she was talking about her late husband. Hard to say.
     
  5. BatmansHooker

    BatmansHooker Well-Known Member

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    I hope we see a little backstory on Madison's past amd her former husband in coming episodes. Be surprised if we didn't see that.
     
  6. Damaniel

    Damaniel Member

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    Huh. I just assumed she was talking about her own drug-riddled past. I guess it never even occurred to me that she could've been talking about her baby daddy (yeah, I hate that term, but I actually don't remember, do we know if she was previously married, and/or if he is now dead?).

    I don't get why there's an issue on how the cops were behaving. I got the vibe that they were just talking to Nick because they were hoping to get a lead on a drug dealer. Inappropriate or not is a moot point. It's realistic, that's what matters.

    As for Madison's reaction, that seems fine too. Sure, ideally she should've been more cooperative with the police, but there are plenty of legitimate reasons to justify why she did that. First and foremost, she was being Madison the Mom, not Madison the Guidance Counselor. Second, it would not be surprising to learn that this situation has come up before, and she knew why the police were there. If the police were really there to look into a possible murder, they wouldn't have left as quickly as they did. They were only there to get a lead on a drug dealer.
     
  7. Neuropyramidal

    Neuropyramidal Well-Known Member

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    Just because a third person isn't interested in a particular topic doesn't make it a moot point. Sure, its realistic, as cops are human and sometimes behave inappropriately, but the point of that discussion was that its not appropriate to try and obtain potentially self incriminating information from a delirious or delusional patient under medical care, which is as valid as it is realistic. What would have actually been even a bit more realistic would have been if when the ICU doc told the cops they couldn't have access to Nick's toxicology, they also couldn't have access to Nick himself until he was cleared by the psychiatrist as being competent to make statements to law enforcement. That's what a competent ICU physician would do real life, if we want to talk about realism.

    As for Maddie, depending on which interview you read, she was actually married and her husband died of unknown causes between 3 and 6 years ago. She actually still wears her wedding ring, if you look closely, not uncommon for a widow, even if they are in a new relationship. And yes, I agree about Maddie: this isn't her first rodeo, she's had a drug addicted son for years apparently, and she's dealt with the police before. She knew exactly why they were there, and knew that they most likely weren't just after the drug dealer but also after other people connected to the drug house, likely including her son, if possible. He was just hit by a car that morning and was likely about to start withdrawals. Her son was there to be treated medically after a trauma and she did the right thing by nipping the situation in the bud. As for whether she was rude to the cops, I honestly say who cares. The cops themselves were rude asking Travis if Maddie wears the pants. Everyone was rude. I personally would have just asked them to leave if they didn't have a warrant to talk to him, and moved on.
     
    #47 Neuropyramidal, Aug 27, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2015
  8. westwingnut

    westwingnut Well-Known Member

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    I suppose the 'appropriate'-ness of the officers' questioning would be up to a judge to decide. Suppose Nick identified Calvin as his dealer, and the police got a search warrant for Calvin based on that information. Would that be considered 'fruit of the poisonous tree'? I love constitutional law but I don't know enough to be able to say.
     
  9. Neuropyramidal

    Neuropyramidal Well-Known Member

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    Its up to the doctor to decide until a judge issues a warrant. And a judge would never issue a warrant to override a physician unless its something urgent or sensitive. If Nick had stuck around and the psychiatrist had deemed him actively psychotic or delirious, and the cops went to a judge and said "hey, we want to talk some more to this kid about a possible lead to a drug dealer but he just got admitted to the hospital and docs won't let us talk to him yet because he's not mentally sound" the judge would probably laugh at them if not reprimand them for wasting his time. Judges override physicians in cases pressing life or death type information is needed urgently, or in cases regarded the patient's medical care, like if family members are opposing each other regarding taking someone off life support. Not for stuff like following up on commonplace leads when a patient is only temporarily incapacitated. In this case its totally up to the docs. Unfortunately in this case, the wrong call was made.
     
    #49 Neuropyramidal, Aug 27, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2015
  10. Damaniel

    Damaniel Member

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    Fair enough. In the end, nothing is a moot point if there are at least two people willing to discuss it lol.

    I agree with you though. Nick himself was beginning to question his sanity. Any physician worth his salt would consider him delirious considering the circumstances.

    I could also see the physician not really caring what the police do with, in the physician's mind, a homeless crazed drug addict (not that it would make the physician's actions okay or legal). Especially considering the physician is probably dealing with the onset of some insidious virus or drug.

    Need to throw in the standard "I am not a lawyer" phrase here, but if a delirious Nick DID give out Calvin's name, wouldn't that at least give the police something to work with? I just really think the cops' intent was to maybe get the name of a drug dealer. I don't think they had any interest in looking into a murder when the only evidence of a murder were the words of Nick.
     
  11. Neuropyramidal

    Neuropyramidal Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I agree, they didn't even have murder on their mind. They chalked the talk of blood and viscera up to hallucinations. They were trolling for a drug bust. But likely not just the dealer, but also anyone related to the church they could gain solid evidence on, including Nick if possible, likely. Its really not about whether they could potentially gain a real lead, its about whether the patient has consented to give the lead. Its a civil rights issue. Being a snitch can be a death sentence in the world of illegal narcotics, so consenting to give that information is a very sensitive issue. You have to have competence to consent. A delirious or psychotic patient can not be said to have that competence.
     
    #51 Neuropyramidal, Aug 27, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2015
  12. EZD

    EZD Well-Known Member

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    We don't know if a doctor even was aware that Nick was with the Cops or anything else for that matter so why does any of this matter anyway?
    No speculation about this alters what we do know or have seen so far and it seemed to me that his Mom was just being a protective mother who happens to be a guidance counselor and likely has been in this same spot before both with her kid and others.

    I don't see how anything that went down that we saw or know there is suspect or odd in any way?

    Police do what they are not supposed to all the time both intentionally and not they are only Human too.

    Also Nick was clearly lucid and was sort of playing with them anyway with no obvious intention of cooperating at all.

    Ca you imagine if he had just told the cops what had happened?
     
  13. Neuropyramidal

    Neuropyramidal Well-Known Member

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    He wasn't clearly lucid, and you can't assess lucidity that quickly. He had been giving statement at the scene and to the doctor about people eating other people, and similar rantings, and he was looking around the room while talking to the cops [almost as if responding to internal stimuli at the time], and laughing inappropriately. Sure, we know that he really DID see those things, which is a bias to our judgement, but to a person just coming on the scene not knowing that background, he was FAR from clearly lucid.
     
  14. EZD

    EZD Well-Known Member

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    He sure seemed lucid enough to me to toy with the cops as he was.
    I believe he was likely somewhere between sane and insane then as the result of the whole day but I read him as being intentionally guarded with the cops but then not so with Travis which signaled to me that he was pretty much OK aside from freaked out by the obvious.
     
  15. Neuropyramidal

    Neuropyramidal Well-Known Member

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    There's a lot more than goes into a person being clear headed than whether they can be sarcastic or toy with cops. An actively psychotic person can sometimes still do both of those things. And sure, we saw a lot of signals that he was okay, both before and after, that the docs or cops didn't see. That's why our viewpoint is advantageous. But we are talking about the viewpoint of the authorities and physicians.
     
    #55 Neuropyramidal, Aug 27, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2015
  16. Damaniel

    Damaniel Member

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    Heck, for all we know, the cops entered 30 seconds prior to the family. If the family hadn't entered, maybe the cops would've arrived at the this-guy-isn't-lucid conclusion and left 5 minutes after they arrived.
     
  17. Morgotha

    Morgotha Well-Known Member

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    Remember that this isn't Nick's first encounter, or hers, with the cops. With a junkie son that she's still trying to protect she has probably talked to the cops a LOT, and knows the procedures down pat. I thought this scene was very realistic, the exception being how polite the cops were.
     
  18. Eternal

    Eternal Member

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    Madison needs to quit with the "I'll tell you later" crap. Her daughter is clearly trying to know what's going on, but she doesn't even tell her jack! She's teetering on my dislike list right now.
     
  19. TyberiusFox

    TyberiusFox Well-Known Member

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    Madison probably my favorite character right now. I'm very excited to see what her character development has in store or her. And It helps that I'm enjoying the acting of Kim Dickens.
     
  20. Walkers_TWD

    Walkers_TWD Well-Known Member

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    What she's suppose to tell her people are coming back from the dead and eating each other :zombies_lol: Honestly I'm not surprised that Travis and Madison are not telling anyone anything ,cause it does sound ridiculous. They kno something is happening but not sure what the heck it is
     

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