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Rick Killing the POW Saviors

Discussion in 'Episode 814 - Still Gotta Mean Something' started by Neuropyramidal, Apr 1, 2018.

  1. purriwinkle

    purriwinkle Well-Known Member

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    Maybe. In this world, at this point, everything is distilled down to basic survival. Our group doesn't have a lot of options if they want to live.
     
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  2. Iris

    Iris New Member

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    Thanks for the welcome. The first half of Season 7, they beat Rick down too much. Not enjoyable. I loved the "Say yes" episode though. Like I said, I've binge watched so everything is fresh in my memory.
     
  3. Ionut

    Ionut Active Member

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    Would it be weird to suggest any scenario of valid self defense with vital interests involved as the correct thing to do?
     
  4. Biffster

    Biffster Well-Known Member

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    Nah, it's just the word "correct" that bugs me. There is no "correct" choice; just a whole bunch of dilemmas with shitty consequences.
     
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  5. HeadHunter

    HeadHunter Member

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    Something many are overlooking is that Rick has just lost his son.

    Forget wrong and right, the father just lost his son. Hes mad, upset, angry, hurt and he wants some sort of relief or revenge. The people he killed were all, in some way, to blame for the death of Carl...and Abraham, Glenn....the list goes on. Hes had more than he can take and hes tired of it all. Hes been the nice guy and had his trust thrown back in his face, so this time hes not giving any more chances.

    Seriously...if you had just lost your son in those circumstances and in that post apocalyptic world, would you really be that different from Rick given all hes been through? Or would you rather watch episodes where they go around hugging each other for an hour and every one is super best friends?

    Rick cant be the boy scout hero some people want him to be, its not that world any more. I like Ricks path, it shows he is human. He makes mistakes, hes not perfect but hes real.

    Its easy to see that Rick needed his Luke Skywalker moment and embrace the dark side for him to be redeemed with Carls letter.
     
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  6. tink

    tink Well-Known Member

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    Maybe it's just me but I don't see someone losing a child as an excuse to go out and murder people. Would you allow that to be an excuse for someone in real life? I sure wouldn't. Jared, sure, he was always going to be a threat, but those other guys were fighting WITH Rick, and so to me that was murder.
     
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  7. Love Made Visible

    Love Made Visible New Member

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    I found it interesting that it was the exact same speech Rick gave to the guy on the road who shot at him and Daryl. At that point in the series, Rick meant what he said. He would have taken that dude back to the Hilltop. And then Daryl was in PTSD/beserker mode and shot him in the head.
     
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  8. Lindigo

    Lindigo Well-Known Member

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    Yes, that beatdown was horrible! One good thing about your binge watch is that you may have a better feeling for the daily passage of time. Because I watch one episode per week and then long breaks between seasons and mid-seasons, I start feeling more time has passed than really has in their world. So I wind up thinking, Why are they putting up with this for so long?!? when really it has hardly been any time for them. For me, Rick put up with Negan too long before finally retaliating, but intellectually I realize it was not very long. I didn't think any group would accept Negan's subjugation. I'm loving the All Out War that finally burst out.
     
  9. NakedCity

    NakedCity Well-Known Member

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    They just waited long enough to be in serious danger and to need their help before fighting WITH R&M. Hadn't they been captured, these clowns would have been part of the raid on the Hilltops.
    Anyway, all these saviors went along with Negan's "let's gruesomely kill one of each groups as an example" way of doing things. I wouldn't let a single one of them alive, Dwight, Alden, and especially not Negan...
     
  10. Duce000

    Duce000 Active Member

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    Well I can’t agree that Rick is worse than Negan but he will match Negan when needed when it comes to being ruthless. This was the first kill I thought rick truly didn’t need to. All the other ones I felt he was justified and I understood completely.

    I honestly thought they had a good chance for a moment like this when Beth got killed. I felt they should’ve had Rick’s group open fire out of just reacting but we saw the other group hesitate and try to say no like they did. That would’ve been a good moment to cause some debate and at that point they were trying to portray Rick as he could be the bad guy really.
     
  11. WillyJakkz

    WillyJakkz Active Member

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    Honestly could be said Rick is responsible for their deaths (Glenn Abraham Carl) as he did attack the Savior outpost killing them in their sleep which was what Negan's vengeance was about leading him to kill Abraham then Darryl reacted leading to Glenn's death, and also Rick stopping Carl from helping the new guy in the camp (can't remember his name) so when Rick left Carl went out on his own to find the guy (Sanji?) to help him and bring him back to the community which led to Carl getting bitten. All of those actions occurred due to Rick's actions.

    The same way Maggie's actions/ decisions led to many of the survivors being infected by the Simon led Savior attack.

    I think both ep's were to show the contrast in how our group views things and how Negan's "people are a resource" views things.
     
  12. Neuropyramidal

    Neuropyramidal Well-Known Member

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    You seem to think that every other character is a mindless robot without their own responsibility. Carl chose to help Siddiq and by happenstance got bitten. To blame that on Rick is like blaming the price of rice in china on uncle Foodstamp farting on Easter Island. Each character behaves of their own free will. And due to that, shit happens. We can't always blame the person we want to blame ;)
     
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  13. MHoskins2179

    MHoskins2179 New Member

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    Echoing what others above have written, in that I truly enjoyed the barn scene and how they finally pushed Rick over that moral line. In particular, I loved the poetic story-telling of how Morgan told him he saved Rick originally because his son was there... that if his son wasn't there, Rick wouldn't have been saved and Morgan would have killed him; just like Rick just did to how many potentially-savable (ex?) Saviors -- yep, because Carl is now gone, he essentially killed off people who could've been in basically the same shoes as he was in at the very beginning. And the shattered mirror image of himself was very well-done to end that scene. I think that's the final straw that pushes Rick into reading Carl's letter and on the path of not killing Negan when that time comes. The same goes for Maggie, who saw the "cost" of war and killing for blood-revenge. And with Negan pretty much there too after hearing of Carl's death and wishes, and with Jadis and Simon's mass Heap-killing, I think we're on that page with him too.
     
  14. TDogResurrected

    TDogResurrected Active Member

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    Since when has the saviors been innocent?
     
  15. EZD

    EZD Well-Known Member

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    No kidding not a single one of them who has been fighting!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  16. TDogResurrected

    TDogResurrected Active Member

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    That long haired rat looking savor killed Morgans little student (that LITTLE kids older brother)...
     
  17. EZD

    EZD Well-Known Member

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    Huh?

    And he is known as Ratface here.
     
  18. WillyJakkz

    WillyJakkz Active Member

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    Nevermind Glenn Abraham...but answer this and I hate using the word "if" but IF Rick allows Carl to help Siddiq like Carl was trying to do does Carl go back into the world looking for Siddiq so he can help him?

    My answer is "No" because Siddiq would've already been helped and in the ASZ community. When Negan told Rick it was his fault Carl died, inadvertently Negan was right.
     

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