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Team Maggie vs. Team Rick

Discussion in 'Episode 903 - Warning Signs' started by Neuropyramidal, Oct 21, 2018.

  1. PepperAnn

    PepperAnn Well-Known Member

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    Ohhhh interesting!
     
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  2. Singtress

    Singtress Active Member

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    I do like this. But not Maggie on her own.
     
  3. Dnae

    Dnae Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
    I see Rick's POV and I can see why Maggie believes as she does. And I have been thinking about this since the end credits last night. So I am going to forum journal my thoughts to work through my conundrum.

    While on paper it is reasonable for those who have been wronged to seek vengeance the reality is that the consequences are going to far outweigh the initial satisfaction that revenge breeds.

    Rick is hellbent on building that "bridge" between all communities. He is idealistic and consumed with his own brand of grief that calls him to honor Carl's wishes. And at times his grief does cloud his judgement. He does however show us moments where his idealism has cracks. Maggie and Daryl are on the other end of the continuum. So fueled by the desire for revenge that they cannot see a life without vengeance. As with Rick, Maggie does have moments when she realizes the value of peace for the future, but she is so clouded with grief and anger that she cannot let go.

    And that brings us to Cindy's statement about Maggie's act of hanging Gregory giving them the green light to seek out their own justice for Oceanside. Again, I can understand the feeling, I can understand the desire to see your enemy suffer. But I cannot help but worry what this will all mean for the already tenuous relationships. Revenge is a festering sore. It will never heal if it keeps getting picked at. And what will these acts of revenge mean to the people who are carrying them out? To quote Daryl from season 4 "these are good people" (i.e. Oceansiders). But after executing so many saviors what will, in time, that do to their psyche?

    And of course revenge begets revenge. It is this vicious cycle. And the only way to end the cycle is to make a conscious decision to do so. Find another way to punish them. Work with Michonne on the charter, incarcerate those for past crimes (war crimes if you will). Bring each of them before a counsel made up of members from each community (and yes, there are members of Sanctuary who were not completely Team Negan who could serve on such a counsel). Something akin to the Nuremberg Trials.

    These executions might be the short term relief for Oceanside, for Maggie. But what will the killings make of them down the line? Will they be able be at peace or will what their actions, in time, haunt them? What will the killings mean to obtaining and maintaining peace among the communities? Trust among the communities? Will everyone be wary of each other? Who can you trust not to stab you if you in some fashion go against them? I just think the possible consequences far outweigh the initial satisfaction.
     
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  4. Jen7

    Jen7 Well-Known Member

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    I can pretty much understand the point of view of every character right now, which to me is one of the strengths of this season so far. I favor what Rick is doing because I think it does create the most peace & trust among the people out of any other method. However, I understand where Maggie & Daryl, Cindy & the Oceansiders, and even some of the Saviors are coming from.

    Ideally they need to be consistent though, which i know is what Michonne is working on with the rules and laws. They can't have some people hung and killed gruesomely while others are allowed to live.

    As for Arat...at first when she knelt there crying I wanted Cindy to spare her...i wanted Daryl & Maggie to intervene if needed. But once I heard that she smiled while killing Cindy's little brother, and made Cindy beg for his life, etc. i realized that she is the type who will kill again if tables turn. She only follows whoever has the advantage and who will benefit her at the moment. Right now it's Rick but what if that changed? She would switch sides in a heartbeat i'm sure. I would prefer to see her in a cell next to Negan though. To me that's a better punishment than the nothingness of death.

    Even so, they need to be prepared for the fallout now that Arat has also gone missing. The saviors were already up in arms when Justin disappeared and was found dead. This ain't gonna be pretty. :eek:
     
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  5. Mother dick

    Mother dick Member

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    I think Rick is right, but it's going to be very difficult to implement in a post-apocalyptic world with no laws.

    Even Maggie admitted that Rick's vision was what was best/safe for her young child. Which makes her 180 at the end of the episode all the more strange.
     
  6. offrope

    offrope Active Member

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    Cyndie stated that Arat was "the last of them". Vengeance from the Oceansiders is now complete. Simon is already dead. Only Negan remains to be killed. Of course, that isn't going to happen, much as it should.
     
  7. Camilleyun

    Camilleyun Well-Known Member

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    I see it more as justice than revenge. Negan was jailed, but the rest of the Saviors have gotten NO punishment. Nothing. Had punishment been dealt, then I would agree with it being mere revenge. Rick being a former lawman should know this better than anyone, it's the entire reason civilized societies have a justice system. It's hard to envision a future and move forward with it alongside people who killed your entire family and half your ZA community and when you have a leader who completely ignores that fact, you're going to have what we had last night.
     
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  8. Lindigo

    Lindigo Well-Known Member

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    For the most part, post-apocalypse people have continued to instinctively adhere to our beliefs about justice.

    The fall back to our own Wild West dispensing of punishment feels realistic and reasonable to me. Even if Michonne's charter had already been adopted, some people would take the law into their own hands, just as they do now in our regulated world with our "thin veneer of civilization."

    Both teams want peace and justice. I don't think they are very far apart in how to achieve it. I'm on both teams.
     
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