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Why didn't Shane kill Dale? (Mercy Killing)

Discussion in 'Episode 211 - Judge, Jury, Executioner' started by Walkers Ate Me, Dec 28, 2012.

  1. Walkers Ate Me

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    Shane and Dale didn't get along at all. You'd think Shane would jump at the chance to put a bullet in Dale's brain when he lie there dying. Instead, he looked to Rick to do it.

    Do you think it's possible that Shane and Dale were slowly getting over their rivalry? They had a decent conversation earlier in the day before Dale died. Well, decent for those two at least. It was the 'friendliest' conversation they'd had since Season 1, I think. I remember Shane telling Andrea that Dale has a big mouth but was harmless. OK, now I'm rambling. lol. Why do you think Shane failed to shoot Dale?
     
    #1 Walkers Ate Me, Dec 28, 2012
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2012
  2. Rapscallion

    Rapscallion Well-Known Member

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    Shane's inaction over Dale's mortal wounding is another example that his only concern was Lori and Carl.

    As the group's second-in-command, Shane should have carried the weight when Rick couldn't bring himself to do what was necessary and end Dale's suffering; and that's not a negative comment on Rick. Rick's the one with the burden of leadership and all his decisions affect the group. The sudden loss of Dale was too much for Rick to take after the loss of Sophia and the quarrel over what to do with Randall.

    Unlike Shane, Daryl showed he would help Rick carry the weight. Daryl replaced Shane as second-in-command the moment he put down Dale.
     
  3. Lewk00t

    Lewk00t Active Member

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    Shane said something to Rick like "Go on." As if Rick needed to kill Dale, after he failed to execute Randall maybe Shane was testing him, had Rick gone all soft that he couldn't even put Dale out of his misery?
     
  4. Nachtbringer

    Nachtbringer Member

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    Well its just natural that you care more for the one you know from before then people you just met on the road.

    I hate it that many people always say that Shane does not care about the group.
    It is true his primary concern is Lori and Carl but there are a few scenes there you can see that he cares at least a bit about the others:

    - Shane drags Glenn away from the RV when the Zombies attack, if he really doesnt care about the group like many say he would just jump below the truck alone.

    - He gives shoot training to the people and personal training for Andrea. If he would not care about them he could have just sayed "**** off".

    - Shane apologize to Andrea instead of drive away alone. If he doesnt care about her he would just leave her alone so she can go back alone.

    - He take care of Carol who is leaving the woods and apologize to her.

    - Shane helped to draw Glenn out of the well, he could just have standed there and say "Whatever..."

    Shane and Dale talk at the beginning of Season 2 about Andreas weapon. He even support Dale in this, I guess later he would not have done this. In this scene they still """like""" each other.

    He just killed Otis not long ago, this is a heavy trauma so I guess its enough for him for now.
    Another reason could be that Shane thought it should be someone who liked Dale like Andrea.
    If I would be Dale I would not want be killed by Shane, the one guy I hate, too. So he looked to Rick but he could not do it as he could not shoot Randall.
     
  5. Walkers Ate Me

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    I forgot all about that scene.

    Interesting point. I wish Shane had lived longer so we could see how that would have played out. That would take Shane from being the Atlanta leader pre-Rick, to second in command under Rick, to third in command, under Rick and Daryl. I don't think Shane could handle that. He grudgingly accepted Rick replacing him as leader, although its debatable if he ever really accepted Rick's leadership.

    I do think Shane was aware of Daryl stepping up. It could be why he offered to drop off Randall along with Daryl. Maybe he figured he could kill them both.
     
  6. Rapscallion

    Rapscallion Well-Known Member

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    Remember that the group hadn't met the Greenes. Shane would go on to sacrifice Otis, influenced Andrea's violent behavior, and threatened the group's stay on the farm. Dale confronted Shane over these matters, but Shane scared him into backing down.

    I got the impression from Shane that he knew he'd taken a great fall from the totem pole, even if Rick didn't acknowledge it. No way Shane would follow Daryl, especially as he considered Daryl to be white trash.

    I also thought Shane planned on killing both Randall and Daryl. But remember that Daryl knew Shane sacrificed Otis. Daryl would've been on guard if Shane got the OK to accompany him. There'd be a fight similar to the one Shane had with Rick. The difference being that Daryl would return to the farm alone.
     
    #6 Rapscallion, Dec 28, 2012
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2012
  7. skaaaa

    skaaaa Well-Known Member

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    Yeah Shane wouldn't have returned regardless if he went with Rick or Daryl. Honestly I could see Daryl just putting a bolt in his face immediately.
     
  8. Machete

    Machete Active Member

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    I am not so sure. Remember how easily Shane took Daryl down in Season 1? I think revisionist history is making Shane much less of a badass than he really was. The only reason Rick was able to kill him was he got Shane to let his guard down.
     
  9. Rapscallion

    Rapscallion Well-Known Member

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    Choke hold's illegal! :zombies_rolleyes:
     
  10. marsyao

    marsyao Member

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    Shan was mentally unstable, but he was not that a bad person, he never meant to harm anybody in his own group except, of course, Rick. even after he decided that, between him and Rick, one must die, when reach the moment of action, he can not make him pulling that trigger.
    On the other hand, Dale was a self righteous annoying old man, he at least tolerated Shane at first, then until he found out Shane had a thing with Andrea, then he freaked out, and start bad mouthing Shane to anybody
     
  11. Walkers Ate Me

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    Good posts in this thread. I figured that Shane would jump at the chance to put down Dale. He had already threatened him a few episodes prior. But I think it was good that someone Dale liked did the job. He had an alright relationship with Daryl. But like many people here say...Shane wasn't an evil person or even a true antagonist. Rick was right when he said Shane's not a bad guy but he's his own worst enemy. When they were 18 miles out and Rick handed Shane that gun and said, "I need you to come back," I wish Shane had listened. Oh well.
     
  12. Nachtbringer

    Nachtbringer Member

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    If were would not be that ***** Lori who had to make a final talk with him I think he would not had killed Randall.
    Right after Lori talk with him a last time, he imediatly go to Rick and tell him about Carl so he can kill Randall and complete his plan.
    I HATE LORI, she is 10x evil then Shane.
     
  13. Walker Shane

    Walker Shane Member

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    There's no way Daryl could take Shane...Shane could scrap and had police training.
     
  14. Walker Shane

    Walker Shane Member

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    This is what I keep trying to explain to people but people dont get it. Shane was ahead of his time regardless of his methods. He said "the right decision is the one that keeps us alive"
     
  15. Rapscallion

    Rapscallion Well-Known Member

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    Lori made a sincere apology, during which she took the blame for destroying Rick and Shane's friendship. Lori hoped Shane would move on (Rick likewise gave him a few chances), but all the apology did was give Shane the hope he still had a chance at Lori.
     
  16. AtlantaOverrun

    AtlantaOverrun Well-Known Member

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    Just like Sophia, only Rick is able to do such things. And know we know Daryl to.
     
  17. Shane357

    Shane357 Active Member

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    He would've killed Randall regardless, he was a threat that needed to be taken care of. But he should have just booked after killing him. I just can't see Shane getting past anything with Lori in his face...
    "Shane don't leave"
    "SHANE SAVE ME"
    "Shane stay away from Carl"
    "Why are you ignoring my son"
    "Can you just leave"
    "Don't leave me"
    Come on... what do you want Lori?

    And let's not forget this:
    "I'm going to ask you to get Rick to kill you, and then get all pissed at him when he does it."

    Shane wasn't "evil" like many people say... He was just a guy trying to survive and help those he loved survive. He also cared about the group; not as much as the Grimes family but he cared about them as friends.
     
  18. Nachtbringer

    Nachtbringer Member

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    Yes I know, I made this post in 2012 right after I watched Season 2.
    I changed my opinion on that long time ago. Shane would not have allowed to let Randell go.

    Be happy you were not on this board 2012-2013.
    Everyone here HATED Shane and they all were talking how bad and evil he was.
    There were only like 5 people on this entire forum who really understood.
    Good old times :D
     
  19. Shane357

    Shane357 Active Member

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    I understand. Back when I first watched the Season, I shared many of those type of thoughts. I'm also almost certain I stupidly wondered why he shot Otis at one moment. During my reaching the episodes my opinion has changed.

    At least there was more discussion xD"
    How do they expect Shane to react though? Lori led him straight on for the first 2 seasons and then goes "Lady Macbeth" on Rick giving him the "he thinks I'm his" godawful speech in 2x09. There is the possibility that she was being sincere in 2x12 but like I've said in another thread if she didn't realise what she was doing due to her own feelings for/against him than that's just as bad as asking him to lose his mind completely.

    Some people say Shane lost his mind completely over Lori but I'm not sure that's the case or the end of the line. She led him on straight. He was ready to drop the whole thing even at the beginning when Rick (whom they believed to be dead) returned. She cut him off without giving him a single chance to explain what happened.

    Yes in TS-19 he is drunk and sexually assaults Lori and that is wrong and terrible, but he backed off immediately and he wasn't trying to dominate or make her feel vulnerable. Lori crushed him emotionally and cruelly when Rick returned, and there was no reason for the 'don't talk to him... don't look at my son' talk she gives him. He did as she asked and ignored Carl, and the she assumes he is purposely being cruel to Carl. That to me is just as wrong, especially when Shane had done right by her and Carl, protecting her son as well as her worthless behind.

    Shane was ready to leave in 2x01 as he told Lori. He was ready to pack and ditch the group with Andrea, when she suddenly tells him to stay. So... she isn't giving him a chance to move on and is sending him mixed signals here and there. How do you expect Shane to feel? If he really loves Lori he's not gonna push a button and get over it. Maybe he could have pulled through if he became entirely convinced she wasn't giving him anymore chances.... IF SHE WOULD JUST GET OUT OF HIS FACE.

    Then in 2x12 she approaches him after hating him after some time and makes a bunch of apologies for stuff far back... I mean I'm glad she wanted to apologize for what she did but you don't say that kind of stuff to someone who's had serious mental trauma. If she couldn't figure that out due to her own feelings than that's just as bad.
     

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