That's like saying Babe Ruth didn't hit homeruns... his bat did.

Shane shot Otis in the kneecap. That wouldn't have killed him. The dozens of walkers that ate him when he fell killed him.

Carol stabbed two people in the head and shot another in the head. That is three direct kills.

You could argue that Shane "indirectly" killed Otis. For that I will award him with a walk. Which leaves his lifetime average still at .333.

 

I was under the impression that he shot him in the leg to slow him down and let the walkers catch up to him. The rukus Otis was raising would have distracted them from Shane letting him get away. Shane killed Otis just the same as if he would have shot him in the head.

 

Your impression is correct, however I can not award him with a direct kill. Had he shot Otis in the head we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

He is awarded an indirect kill.

What Shane did to Otis is very similar to Carl's killing of Dale... in my mind anyway.

 

I disagree. Shane knew exactly what he was doing while Carl didn't.

 

Alright, this has been hashed out 20 times already, but what the hell. There's actually a few points I'd like to address that no one has brought up...

Shane killed Otis to save his own skin and because of his vicarious desire to be Carl's dad/Lori's husband. He also allowed/aided in Randall's escape, and he did THAT in a very cowardly manner by making it seem as though Randall had ambushed him. He did all of that just so he could kill the kid in COLD BLOOD.

He attempted to murder Rick not once (with a giant wrench), not twice (pulling a gun on him in the field), but three times. Yeah.... it was the first time, back when they were hunting for the deer. Shane had his gun sights on Rick and I'm certain that he would have pulled the trigger had Dale not been there to call him out. Shane did all of this out of his obsession for Lori and Carl.

Carol didn't have any selfish/sinister/psychotic motives when she killed Karen. Was it something that she had to do? Probably not. But it wasn't to hook up with some post apocalyptic floozy. lol

As far as Carol killing Lizzie.... Well Lizzie had to go. There's no question about that.

 

Carl had no ill intent. Shane did. It's more similar to the Governor hitting Martinez in the head with a golf club and feeding him to the walkers.

 

Yes, the walker that Carl failed to report to anyone.

 

And here's another thing....

A lot of people are all up in arms about what Carol did. However, the situation with Lizzie is very similar to that of Rick and crazy Clara. Yet no one gave two shits about Rick killing her. Rick killed Clara in self defense because she was crazy and tried to kill him.

Same goes for Carol. She killed Lizzie because Lizzie was crazy train and Carol recognized the fact that Lizzie would continually put her, Tyreese and Judith in constant danger. Either by trying to murder them or by bringing walker play-date buddies over to wherever they were at. From where I see it, Lizzie was probably the most dangerous person on the show.

 

Carl did not kill Dale. A walker killed Dale.

 

You're right! I had forgotten about that one...

That brings his average down to .250.

How can anyone compare him to Carol? LOL.

 

I agree. A lot of people tend to forget that, in the beginning, Shane wasn't a bad guy. He made pragmatic decisions to help Lori and Carl survive and was a great survivalist. And while killing Otis may have been questionable, it does seem like that was the best option if he wanted to save Carl. Unfortunately, he became a man driven by obsession. This led to rash decision making, which led to his plot to kill Rick, which led to his own death.

I would say that season 1 to about mid-way through season 2 Shane is similar to season 4 Carol. However, late season 2 Shane is anything but. He became a petty, jealous man. He was driven by his love for Lori, although at that point I hesitate to call it true love; obsession seems more accurate. And it killed him. In this way, he's nothing like Carol. I don't ever see her going down that path.

 

I'm not sure Rick would be able to kill (a crazy) Carl the same way Carol did with Lizzie. What is left of his family is more important for him than the rest of the group. What makes Rick protecting the group is that for the moment he hasn't any safier solution than large groups. Hope he won't have to choose beetween Judith and Carl one day, that'd be a real dilema.

 

No comparison. Shane would never kill a confused 12 year old girl execution style.

 

I've always thought Shane was also driven crazy by the guilt of leaving Rick. Rick didn't forgive him, what he did was much worse Rick understood what Shane did without recrimination or judgement. The problem with that if the situation was reversed does anyone think Rick would have left Shane? Even if we do Shane didn't. Rick spent the first 2 seasons being just that much "better" then Shane...... of course Rick went back for Merle , of course Rick looked for Sophia , of course Rick understood Lori slept with Shane , of course Rick agonized about Randall. Which each difference of opinion Shane became more and more desperate for Rick to "sink" to his level when Rick never did rather then face Rick was a better person it became black and white to Shane if Rick is not wrong I am evil, therefore Rick must be wrong and is a danger.

 

He would have thrown a giant wrench at her, or pinned her against a tree and snapped her neck.

 

Shane deffo looked the hotter of the 2 with a buzz cut haha.

 

If it was only 3m I can see fat people still being around. That does make sense. IDK why I was thinking it was a full year.

He clearly killed Otis so he could escape. He had his reasons, his own life and Carl's, it was definitely one of those grey areas. I just don't think those reasons were entirely selfish or that he was a monster. Ruthless? Yes. It appeared that it was either one of them or none of them. Shane picked himself. I don't know that I would say it was justified, and I never said that, so much as he had what to him were compelling reasons to do what he did. IDK who in the group would be like "here you take this backpack back to the farm I'll just be here getting eaten alive by walkers".

 

Oh yeah, huh. LOL. I was thinking that he stabbed her, but she was the one who did it. Well.... I guess I'll have to go into the corner and put on my Dunce cap and keep quiet for a few weeks. Goodbye everybody!!!

 

This posts sums up this thread pretty well.