the "all life is precious" will come to play against someone next sunday, for sure!
It will be interesting seeing who is gonna be affected. Meaning: who is going to die!

 

I agree with this argument. However I also see why Rick, Carol and Michonne were concerned about his choices. They're thinking more "big picture" in the sense that him letting those people go could provide those people with future opportunities to cause more harm to their group. Whereas Morgan is thinking more about the butterfly effect of what his actions would lead to. Hence the example he gave of his first and second encounters with Rick. All good points from both sides.

Honestly if I were Rick, going forward, I'd let Morgan beat them up with his ninja stick and let them go. Then I would follow the would be attackers and kill them when Morgan was meditating or doing his Karate Kid exercises. Cuz that's how I roll. lol

 

If "how they currently are" endangers the lives of my community, then, yes, I would condemn them. Morgan already gave that wolf his chance and the wolf basically told him "I'll have to kill you Morgan, and then all the children...." I think at that point you have to say "Well, I tried." And say this wolf said, "You know Morgan, you're right. I renounce my evil ways. I guess I'll stay here now. Which house is mine?" Would you really be okay with this guy living amongst you?

And for all the examples for those who did change, what about those who didn't change or changed for the worse? The Governor, the Claimers, Termites, Grady Hospital. There are examples on both sides of the argument, but I think you have to err on the side of caution. You can give people a chance, but geez the Wolves seemed pretty irredeemable to me. When you go around hacking dudes to pieces and painting their blood on your faces and being totally content with your life choices, I think it's pretty obvious these guys have passed the point of no return. ("Too far gone" if you will.)

 

Really? Michonne coming out of her shell as she became comfortable with the group, Carol becoming confident and self assertive.. These are your examples? There is a Huge difference between Generally nice good natured people like Michonne and Carol evolving.... and someone who is a believer of an idoloigy of killing innocent people who vows to kill Morgan and everyone else at Alexanderia if he does not die. If you can't tell the difference you have some serious problems.

 

Not everyone can change and it's not just nurture. Even in societies where all basic needs are met and there's little poverty, with free education and numerous other resources - there are still very bad people among them. Maybe less due to less desperation, but you can't fix everyone and there will always be bad seeds.

I don't see where Morgan can be corrected, he's a lost puppy swinging on an extremist pendulum. The Wolf thing is unbelievable to think about, it is complete insanity.

 

While I can understand Morgan's point, remember that he killed a LOT of innocent people in his crazy days. How many people should they let that Wolf kill before deciding if he'll change or not? If I lived there and my family was at risk? None. The Wolf isn't having some psychotic or post-traumatic breakdown, he's a cool, calm, killer, and he told Morgan he's going to keep killing if given the chance. He's not worth them taking a risk on, or wasting further resources on.

 

Good people who have been traumatized due to experiences in the ZA can come back, however some people are bad eggs to begin with and no amount of leniency or good intentions will cause them to change. Eastman was a psychologist, wasn't he? He was trained to read people and to make decisions based on his education and experience. Unfortunately, Morgan is not. Eastman said he could recognize pure evil, like the man who killed his family. Had he made it to the ASZ with Morgan he might have told him that this wolf guy couldn't be saved. Morgan is applying what he thinks he learned but has no experience to know if he is doing the right thing. That's dangerous. He doesn't live by himself in the woods so if he's wrong others most likely will be hurt. That's dangerous.

He should have opened up at the meeting and told everyone about what he'd done. Then the guy's fate would have been a collective decision and the weight wouldn't have rested with Morgan alone. By not saying anything, he's basically committing a lie of omission. I would think it's not a good idea to lie to the people who took you in.

 

In our world it is a complicated decision, but IMO in the Walking Dead world:

Threat to the group = you die

I would have killed Morgan when he was an armed psycho, even if there was potential for him to change. It is about surviving now, this show makes it clear every week what happens to you when you try to be Mr. Nice Guy

 

Then we would have the Randall situation all over again... This time Rick would put him down in 2 seconds flat.

 

Kind of a Randall situation on steroids. Requiring Wolf and Morgan to be put down.

 

I agree, it wouldn't be pretty. Morgan has a good idea what Rick and co would do to that wolf which is no doubt the reason he's keeping his little experiment a secret. And that's what it is..... his little social experiment at everyone else's expense. Thank goodness Carol is on it now.

 

Imagine after the prison battle all of Ricks group adopted Morgan's philosophy and decided not to kill anyone ever again. Carol couldnt rescue Ricks group from Terminus with just a stick so would have to try to talk to them . Please Termites we are all good. Later Gareth would be saying that woman was right; they were all good ... with a little bit of barbecue sauce.

 

I think to talk about Morgan we have to take a moment and talk about Eastman first....

1 I think Eastman's belief that almost no-one is actually evil , was theoretical and extremely limited. As in , "In a hypothetical world where Person A was not abused they may not have become a killer.", "If person B was treated for their delusions sooner they may not have become a killer." To Eastman only a person who would under all hypothetical circumstance commit evil acts is an evil person. Everyone else is a sick person who does terrible things. Note: he never said these people should be freed , that they were curable and that they were not dangerous , just not evil. Also one of Eastmen's first questions to Morgan was "You killed people in self defense?" its very likely his "treatment" of Morgan would have been different if Morgan answer "Yes I have killed people but only in self-defense"

2) Eastman is the only person in the show who we are sure was a premeditated murder, even the claimers who were on the fringe and clearly criminals I don't think they made clear any of them murdered anyone before the ZA. Eastman's starved someone to death over the course of 47 days, all the while giving him water. Before the ZA that is heinous.

Let that sink in Eastman tortured someone to death over the course of 7 weeks before the sh*t hit the fan. Morgan killed anything he came across , living or death , threat or benign.

This is why it was so important for Eastman and Morgan to cling to "All life is precious and no-one is really evil everyone is just suffering from PTSD" They both may have changed , recovered and redeemed themselves ,but in their own ways they were both as bad of villains as any we have seen so far in TWD(At lest to their victims). If the wolf is not redeemable then why should Morgan be allowed to live? From Morgan's POV.

So while I get why Morgan is so stuck on the idea , it's still a terrible idea. BTW I think they did a fantastic job giving us Morgan's POV, I'm enjoying being mad at Morgan. It's a lot more fun to be mad a character with some depth , who we liked and understand.

 

To put it simply, I think his philosophy is b.s, certainly under a zombie apocalypse. Morgan kind of creeps me out, he has a cult leader vibe going on, with his soft-spoken and delusional persona. If someone presents a violent and ruthless threat, you have no choice but to put him/her down, otherwise it could jeopardise innocent lives. It's strange considering the fact if he does think 'all lives are precious', then how does it make sense to spare the lives of people who take away other 'precious lives' for sport ?

 

Are you saying the wolves and Eastman were similar types? Shouldn't we take motivation into account? I don't buy it that Eastman was a heinous villain.

Eastman was too hard on himself, IMO. The sociopath he starved to death had killed his whole family for no other reason except that Eastman recognized him for what he was and tried to keep him from being released back into society. OK, so he had a little mental breakdown but that sociopath had plenty of time to contemplate his actions before he met his maker. Eastman was going to turn himself into the authorities but then the ZA broke out. Not killing anyone anymore was his way of making reparations BUT he lived by himself in the woods and could afford to indulge in his new lifestyle, although I doubt he would have killed again anyways. Who else would get hurt if he got it wrong? And I have to imagine he might have had to revise his philosophy if he had actually run into some of the people Rick's group had come in contact with.

Morgan would be better served if he used his new found sanity to protect the people that mean something to him. That would be a suitable reparation for not being able to protect his son, and for taking the lives of "innocents" if they were all indeed innocent. We don't know for example that the two guys we saw Morgan kill in epi four didn't intend to do him harm. His encounter with Rick was unfortunate but no one was killed. There has to be some part of him that realizes this wolf guy could do a lot of damage. That they kill for very different reasons than why he was killing people. Eastman's methods aren't gonna work on this guy and Morgan can't or won't see it.

 

All life is precious......NOT

Rick should have shown Morgan and his wolf friend the gate as soon as he got back from killing those 5 wolfs, upon learning that Morgan lets them live to attack and kill others.

AND TAKE YOUR STICK WITH YOU.

No...I change my mind. He could later change back into that psycho killer, better to put one of those magnum bullets between his eyes....he is too dangerous with that stick.

As far as the captured wolf...just have carol deliver some cookies.

 

People sometimes change. That doesn't mean you should trust them to change. When you are dealing with systematic serial killers and mass murderers, you don't trust them to change, when it means putting your family in danger. Eastman took a risk on Morgan and got lucky. He had no family to worry about. ASZ is a family. You don't put your family at risk, hoping someone will change. You eliminate the threat.

 

Let's say the 5 wolves he released wasn't killed by Rick, and gathered a bigger group to return to Alexandria, would we be expected to release them again, hoping they would eventually change?

For me, I would assume the best of people until they have proven otherwise, not despite of it.

Who are we to judge? Well, if some strangers were to invade my home and slaughter my friends, I think it's well within my right to judge, its not as if we could leave it to justice system in the ZA.

 

They don't have the luxury of agonising over Morgan's feelings at the moment. Every second they waste wringing their hands and considering whether it's OK to kill people, some other group is a second closer to slaughtering and eating them all. Morgan needs a bullet. He's an unacceptable liability.