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Preparations ?

Discussion in 'Episode 614 - Twice as Far' started by br0k3n, Mar 21, 2016.

  1. Mister_Baker

    Mister_Baker Member

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    You don't think they searched the Sat Comm station, and the Slaughterhouse afterword? That seems like a pretty obvious thing they would do.
     
  2. Morgotha

    Morgotha Well-Known Member

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    I really doubt they searched the slaughterhouse, as it was overrun with walkers. On the comm station? The group hasn't done "pretty obvious" things since the show started, there's no reason to think they would now, especially as their goal was to go get Maggie and Carol, not look around - case in point, they didn't notice Daryl's motorcycle in the open garage by the time they were leaving the station, nor did they notice its rider hiding out. How thorough of a search could they really have done? Motorcycles and men aren't exactly small hidden items that would be easy to miss in a casual search.
     
  3. Mister_Baker

    Mister_Baker Member

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    Overrun with the walkers that are relatively easy to kill at this point? And most of which are impaled and not going anywhere? Yeah, that'd send Rick and Co running for the hills.

    I meant that they went back and searched the Comm Station after they rescued Carol and Maggie. Heath and Glenn found the armory, do you think they just went "Meh, we don't need these, or any food that could be here. Lets just head home."
     
  4. Morgotha

    Morgotha Well-Known Member

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    Yep, I bet they did.

    That's like asking, "do you think Rick really just SHOT the only prisoner they had rather than interrogating him for what other communities they might be in contact with, or what other safe houses he knows about that they could raid for supplies, or what other Saviors might be out there?" I mean who would do something so irresponsible?

    From my TWD watching experience, I'd say assuming they did NOT do the sensible thing would be the safer bet.
     
  5. Mister_Baker

    Mister_Baker Member

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    Well that's just silly, but whatever.

    Primo said he was Negan, and at that point, Rick had no reason to doubt him. Carol or Maggie didn't tell him about the "We are all Negan" comment by Molly, and they had one mission, which was to eliminate Negan and the Saviors.

    If they want to find out about other groups, they can just ask Jesus or Gregory. If there are any other hostile groups out there in the vicinity, they'd probably tell Rick and Co of them too.
     
  6. Morgotha

    Morgotha Well-Known Member

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    So Rick thinks he's got Negan - the Big Boss of the Saviors, and you think it would be silly to question him about their holdings, possessions, communities they know, etc? We have very different ideas of what is silly.

    And why would Negan tell Gregory or Jesus *anything* about other groups they've met?
     
  7. br0k3n

    br0k3n Member

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    Not dodging a thing [MENTION=105401]Mister_Baker[/MENTION], indeed I am trying to give a big picture to support common sense security measures - which you have argued against SOLELY on the encounter with Saviors.

    Never suggested they should "beat Jesus up".
     
  8. Mister_Baker

    Mister_Baker Member

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    He was supposed to kill Negan, he thought he had him, so he killed him. Boom. Back to trading with the Hilltop.

    They had already wiped out at least 30 other people who were a part of The Saviors, and even if there were a few more, with their leader dead, the group would probably fall apart, and start fighting with each other for control of the group, and end up killing each other. Threat gone.,

    Did you not hear Jesus allude to different communities back in Knots Untie? He said it was his job to look for more settlements to trade with. Maggie asked him if that meant that there were more settlements around the area, to which Jesus responded by smiling and saying "You're world is about to get a whole lot bigger."

    Do they need to spell it out?
     
  9. Mister_Baker

    Mister_Baker Member

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    Even if they believe there are another hostile group out there other than The Saviors, how are they supposed to know where they are? What more should they do to prepare other than get more weapons and ammunition, and rebuild the sniper tower.

    The beat Jesus up comment was a joke, btw.
     
  10. Morgotha

    Morgotha Well-Known Member

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    We just have to disagree here. If it was me, I would have wanted to know what "Negan" knew before executing him.
     
  11. Morgotha

    Morgotha Well-Known Member

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    Well, for one thing you could ask Negan about other groups he's had run ins with, and where they are located.... wait, no you can't, you killed him.
     
  12. Mister_Baker

    Mister_Baker Member

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    Alright, agree to disagree :Grin:
     
  13. Mister_Baker

    Mister_Baker Member

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    They can ask The Hilltop, who would be more likely to cooperate.
     
  14. br0k3n

    br0k3n Member

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    I do believe this was the very point of the OP. Beyond rebuilding the tower, they should have recon putting eyes and ears on adjacent territories. Regular patrols outside the gates. And now that they have radios, they should assimilate them and expand on their own capabilities. Anyone knowledgeable about crystals could make them unique to their units. Now that they have expanded their cache of weapons and vehicles, they have no excuses for failing to build a coalition with Hilltop and other groups, and offering training and weapons as a bargaining chip.
     
  15. Mister_Baker

    Mister_Baker Member

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    Why should they waste their time and gasoline by patrolling different areas for groups that might not exist?
     
    #55 Mister_Baker, Mar 25, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2016
  16. Prufrock

    Prufrock Well-Known Member

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    Yes, in other "gearing up" scenes there is the presence of conversations that broke up the "gearing" (thinking esp. Welcome to the Tombs and so many other prison episodes) or to illustrate madness (The Gov in I Ain't Judas).
     
  17. br0k3n

    br0k3n Member

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    in a word: survival.

    I would gladly "waste" gasoline if it meant my group got advance warning on an impending attack, rather than getting surprised. Get it?

    You are asking "why" do we fund a national defense? Why do we develop surveillance technology? Why do we spend blood and treasure? What I am discussing has direct bearing on the survival of the group in a chaotic world.

    Further, in a specific discussion about fuel reserves, the group should be scouting farms for horses. Locating some multi-fuel vehicles would also be a tremendous asset. Not ALL recon teams necessarily need a vehicle for the duration of their mission.
     
  18. Mister_Baker

    Mister_Baker Member

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    They have no idea where any other groups are, besides The Hilltop. If they had a clue that there was a potentially hostile group somewhere near them, then sure, they should scout out that group, and see if they really are a threat. But they don't. The last hostile group was wiped out, at least they thought they were.

    As for this whole reconnaissance thing, they could always start up their recruiting thing that Aaron, Eric and Daryl had. They'd weed out different people, see if they were safe enough to bring back to Alexandria. If they come across any bad people, then they could just inform Rick that there's a potentially dangerous group that they might want to keep their eyes on.
     
    #58 Mister_Baker, Mar 25, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2016
  19. Expat-N-America

    Expat-N-America Active Member

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    Jsus would be the key here. We need to see a scene where Rick grills Jesus about this "bigger world" and what it entails.

     
  20. br0k3n

    br0k3n Member

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    [MENTION=105401]Mister_Baker[/MENTION] I'm not sure I can help you understand, because you're using circular reasoning. "How should they know where others are? Why should they waste gas? Don't recon until they know there's a hostile group" are things you're saying.

    What ive been trying (and failing) to get through to you is that your group DOESN'T and WON'T have any Intel until you start sending out reconnaissance teams. Waiting for time and chance or strangers (Jesus) to enlighten you is playing Russian roulette.

    It's as if you're telling Christopher Columbus and NASA not to waste precious time and resources exploring the unknown.

    In a hostile environment, our group needs to be proactive about gathering information about what and who is in the vicinity. You mention Aaron going out recruiting. Yes, this is similar to what I'm describing. Sending out some long range reconnaissance patrols equipped to observe and survive outside the walls. They will locate resources, observe the activities of any survivors, and report back to Rick.

    Recon teams should be a regular assignment that able bodied man and women train for and execute for the good of the community. Depending on the assignment details, some teams would be driven out to a predetermined location and dropped off to begin their patrol. A pickup date and location are established.

    Other teams might require the use of vehicles or horses for the duration of the patrol.

    I'm just not inclined to continue arguing this point with you. Reconnaissance is a common sense assignment that every standing military on this planet practices. Alexandria is the ZA equivalent of a Bronze Age city-state, and should be conducting itself in a way to secure its long term survival.
     

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