Really? Where they could have potentially set traps to cover their tail and could have potentially set up an ambush (which they did)? Daryl and the rest set off to track them down. They lost. An argument can be made that immediate action would have left the remaining Saviors less prepared, but had Rick and Co. set off after them immediately, they'd have been only marginally more prepared, if at all.

 

No it isn't, considering they were AMBUSHED there.

 

Im sorry! Lol ! I'm reading this all in Eugene's voice.

 

If by broad direction you mean between north and south... ehh.. maybe.

 

Even if Rosita did give a report to leadership, what makes you think that everyone has detailed information of that report? I'd assume that Rick and Maggie are leadership and are the ones with the info. Considering that Glen and Michonne are banging those two, they probably have some idea of where to go and what to look for. However, it's not like they stopped and grabbed a copy of said report and carefully reviewed it and came up with a plan of attack. There is absolutely no way that Michonne and Glenn have the same detail of information that Rosita does, no matter how good of report she did/did not submit. The exact path that they left on would be paramount since daryl will be tracking from that spot, hence where they would need to start tracking daryl.

 

Considering that all of the things they had time to do were spread among several different characters, all of those things could have been accomplished that same day. This episode could very well have taken place the day later. Especially since Carol could have been getting ready to leave while the group was being ambushed. Maybe Rick and the gang were going to put together a plan of action that day and Daryl went off by himself. Also, they know that the saviors know where they live and could be coming their way. It may be better to let the enemy come to you since you are in a reinforced position.

 

If I set off due east from one point on the tracks, I'm not going to arrive at the same location I'd hit heading due east from 50 feet further down the tracks.

Presumably they did not follow a compass and head due east. I realize that 'east' technically encompasses only one literal direction, but every possible point in the world is due east of some other point.

I rather doubt that they'd have had geographic coordinates and precise bearings to follow. It logically follows that a visual memory of them heading off from a certain spot in a certain direction is more useful than saying "we were about 1000 feet from the road on the tracks and they went northeast." This description doesn't imply that walking 1000 feet down the tracks and turning directly northeast is going to lead you to them. It's going to put you in the ball park. It's not necessarily going to get you a homerun.

Meanwhile, Rosita did lead them directly to the Saviors, albeit in a roundabout way.

 

From some of the quotes from the previous episode, it sounded like Rick and the gang are expecting an attack on the safe zone. They may see holding down the fort as a more formidable plan then facing an unknown enemy face to face out on the road or in the woods.

 

It has been thoroughly explained to you over and over again throughout this thread, so it's probably pointless to explain it again...but running off half-cocked like that would have likely led them right into a ambush. And in fact, they ran off half-cocked in pursuit of them...and ran straight into an ambush. You can keep debating about how going after them would have been a better idea if you want...but they did go after them. It didn't work out so well.

Pick off key leadership? Assemble recon teams? So what are we going to do? Send out the unseasoned red shirt Alexandrians to do all of this? Or are we just going to split up all of the seasoned fighters and send them away from home, thus drastically reducing the defenses on hand? We don't have a limitless standing army here. We have like 12 people who know what they're doing, another 10 who kind of know what they're doing, and another 40 who barely know what they're doing.

So we send out all of these recon teams and sniper teams...and then the Saviors attack Alexandria. What then? We've sent away all of our fighters, so now they're basically free to just come in and do what they do.

Defending a reinforced location makes far more sense to me. Starving them out? What exactly are you picturing here? The Saviors aren't the kind of group that are going to sit there and wait for the Alexandrians to get starved out.

 

They should have been doing many things from the start. Upon arriving at ASZ originally they were dumbfounded to find that ASZ didn't even permit weapons inside the walls, had no lookout, had no security measures of any kind what so ever and were talking a lot of sense prior to finding out major hostiles were in the near area.

Since the Wolves attack the writers have written them in as tactically inept, but still defeating other tactically inept people.

The Saviors have radio's and have more order, but they have been proven poor fighters and likely consist of mostly ordinary people that became Saviors and not former Military or anybody trained in combat. That was so far, the next wave and command is likely to consist of former Military, LE, whatever and that would give some explanation on how an organized group with effective radio usage and outposts are functioning despite being trash fighters. Having organization from the top.

Our group's initial handling of the Saviors was arrogant and lucky it went down so well. They've made massive tactical errors since leaving the Prison and didn't even use common sense surveillance of the area before entering Terminus.

Both sides of the argument here and making good points, but some things aren't shown on the show for time constraints.

It can be assumed that Rosita/Daryl/Abe/Eugene told about the attack in detail. Rosita is not in error here for being asked which way they ran by people who were not apart of the skirmish(and its true that the Saviors could have spread out to anywhere by now), but Rosita is in error for following Daryl after finding him and walking into a trap, Glenn and Michonne were in error for wandering aimlessly...

The whole group is in error constantly for their preparations - we can list those out for days. But IMO those details are small issue's compared to seriously massive problems like allowing Morgan, an internal threat, to live. If you're doing that as the foundation then everything built upon that foundation is going to be disorganized and ****ed.

If they just cleaned out the Saviors without getting hit hard it'd be a boring show. The show is surviving and making errors in the setting of the ZA. Although I have grievances with character portrayals going on right now.

 

I agree, but that's easier said than done if you've noted the mental and physical conditions of some of these jokers. Then again I guess whale Olivia and others can't be considered "able bodied".

I'd like to backtrack a bit to the arrival to ASZ, where there was intense opposition from the ASZ residents and the ASZ leader until the Wolves attack to even have guns inside in the walls. Post walker herd is a 2 month time span of relative peace and rebuilding, they really don't have that much to work with(they've done some stuff, as said below) and the Saviors issue is new. Poorly handled, but new.

Rosita had been giving lessons on basic close quarter combat and how to deal with Walkers for a while. But getting clowns to be able to dispatch walkers with knives and machetes and utilize basic firearm proficiency is different from being able to convert them all into even a 1/2 equivalent of the team that took out the outpost.

The outpost team are particularly skilled. Minus the ASZ guy who I forget his name with Glenn, although he's at the upper most tier of ASZ capabilities, one of the few.

One thing I am confused of is how Hilltop wouldn't have further knowledge of the Saviors... Hilltop thought the outpost was all the Saviors had or they kept info? It's very possible that the one outpost subjugated Hilltop.

Either way I don't think Hilltop has but a few capable fighters and they had no weaponry. This can change but this takes time to get everything up to speed and the timespan here is short.

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No need for that.

There's logistical issue's that arise with going on the offensive. Fuel limitations, human resource limitations and ammunition, etc..

They started off wrong and didn't have the whole picture and I agree hunkering down defensively and being disorganized is asking for an ass whipping, but they really are not a trained military force as a unit and are still resource limited.

They could do a lot better of course, but I don't think they have the capabilities to go about as you are suggesting. You are suggesting correct tactics, I'm not arguing that, but you're suggesting correct tactics for a well oiled machine and not what they have.

 

lol... relax.. I was kidding.

Besides the general term east, when you have a railroad track running north and south is pretty clear.
You start at the site of the bodies... and head into the field. _ Its not like they could see where they went once they passed the field. So basically all they need is a generalized direction. "head off the tracks into the field when you get to the site of the shootout." would have worked as well.

 

1. You do realise that Rick did in fact implement security measures after he took over Alexandria? They were patrolling the walls and people were armed within the walls. So I don't understand how you think their inept at everything just because they screwed up this episode.

2. How did they make an errors attack the Saviors compound? They did a pretty damn good job, I might say.

3. Why does Morgan deserve death? He didn't do anything wrong. He may have made some stupid decisions, but he doesn't deserved death because of it.

 

Next episode Gabriel is in charge of Alexandria's security. Happy now?

 

Why do you say that? When Carol met the truck full of incompetent men on the road, they noticed her car, and that it looked just like the ones outside the ASZ. The Saviors clearly are spying on them, meaning that they DO have patience, they didn't just try and storm the place as soon as they found it. And the truck full of yahoos? They weren't about to assualt the ASZ by themselves, not after the ASZ wiped out about 40 of their guys without a single loss, so clearly they were going to do more spying, not mindlessly attack. The only reason they went after Carol is they thought she was an easy target of opportunity.

Also, with Hilltop, even though the Hilltop people didn't have guns and the Saviors do, they didn't knock the wall down with a truck and start shooting everyone, they killed a guy, and said, "let's talk". Again, they have *patience*, something that Rick's group lacks in the extreme.

Can you see Negan's group surrounding the ASZ and picking off anyone who leaves over a period of months? I can. The reason is they have the patience to spy on them before doing anything. Can you see Rick's group doing the same to Negan? Nope. Not in a group that runs off in every direction whenever anyone feels the call of the wild.

 

Yeah. The Saviors are 0-5 in tactical situations, but strategically they've been doing the right thing. The Saviors are bigger and more organized. Even after losing so many men they still had the ability to send out recon parties and find the ASZ.

Still, even in hindsight, did Rick's group make an error in attacking the Comm Center? Hard to say. The ASZ was running out of food, and conflict with the Saviors was inevitable. Why not attack when you have the element of surprise in your favor. Rick's group would have been at a severe disadvantage with or without the attack.

I'm not a reader of the comic. I don't know how this plays out. But from the looks of things the only way out is for the other communities under the Saviors to rise up against their oppressors.